I'm in Bolivia ready to buy a bike! Chinese bike or Honda?

[kevinballa]

Helloo all

My friend and I landed in Bolivia today and are excited to start our 2.5 month tour through Bolivia, Peru, Ecuador and Columbia (a lot of riding). We have our gear, GPS routes, maps all ready to go...only thing left is the bike purchase and we need your advice!

The biggest help here would be from fellow riders who have purchased brand new Chinese bikes in South America. How did it go for you?

Here are our options:

Option 1: A brand new 250cc Chinese bike, costs $1,500 (US). We are going to be riding a lot, and all of the dealers themselves have mentioned that they require a good amount of maintenance (bad news). Most saying that we would need to give the bike a rest every 4 hours and let it cool off for 30 minutes because the engine gets super hot (is this normal?). Another dealer mentioned we will probably end up replacing a piston $100 (US) on our bikes before the end of our Bolivia route(?). Overall, I´m not getting good energy from the Chinese knock offs

Option 2: Purchase a used Honda 125cc CGL (or similar, have any suggestions?) for around $2,500 (that is if we can find any available for both my friend and I). It will probably be very old with a lot of miles, and again, we risk mechanical problems if the replacement parts are crap or if the bike was not maintained well.

Here is what it boils down to...we are budgeting up to $2,500 for a bike, and we have 2.5 months to spend in South America. We´re looking to get more riding in and less time spent on the side of the road broken down, sitting in shops, and twiddling our thumbs. If we can get by with purchasing a Chinese bike for $1,500 and only deal with a couple of repairs, that would be phenomenal. If it will require religious maintenance and prayers every day, should we look elsewhere?

Again, any trip reports or insight from fellow advriders who have purchased a brand new Chinese bike would be extremely helpful. Thank you guys so much! -Kevin :lol:

[SpudRider]

Welcome; we are glad you joined us, Kevin. :)

I certainly do recommend you purchase a Chinese motorcycle. Forum member Old Gringo lives in Peru, and has helped several visitors purchase Chinese motorcycles. The rumors you heard from the dealers are ridiculous. :roll: An air cooled, single cylinder, Chinese engine is very reliable, and doesn't require much maintenance. :) Here are links to several ride reports from owners of Chinese motorcycles.

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=371656
http://www.danielmontejo.com/Pictures/motofall2005/themachine.htm

I suggest you post photographs and descriptions of several motorcycles you are considering. We will be glad to help you decide which Chinese motorcycle might be best for your trip. :)

Spud :)

[humanbeing]

Stay AWAY from those pushrod 250 for long trip , they're on "steroid" (bore/ stroke) !!!
The original design (bore/ stroke) ARE much safer & easier to get parts in long trip.
Honda CGL125 is made by Wuyang-Honda in China. Brazil made CG are much stronger BUT $$$ talks.
NEW chinese pushrod 125 also quite capable for these kind (<55mph ) of tour.
One of those trip on chinese 125 http://www.motorfans.com.cn/bbs/viewthread.php?tid=628846&extra=&originator=yes&authorid=163526

[katoranger]

I vote for a 200cc Chinabike. Known reliable engines. Will need alittle prep before hitting the road.

Check bolts, cables, wiring. Fuel lines. Make sure jetting is correct. The old honda is probably just as likely to break down as a new Chinabike.

[kevinballa]

Thanks for the feedback guys! We went to the market again and took photos of our 5 options. If you have any experience with a similar bike, or recognize any parts on these bikes that are clearly going to be trouble, we would like to hear from you! :)

Option 1 - http://imgur.com/a/LDUUU - Pegasus 250cc (Korean made)
OPtion 2 - http://imgur.com/a/2cfdT - Mizumo 250cc (Chinese made)
Option 3 - http://imgur.com/a/Dp5EV - Montero 250cc (Brazilian made)
Option 4 - http://imgur.com/a/DDf4Q - Fenix 250cc (Korean made)
Option 4 (same model, different photos) - http://imgur.com/a/oxqRA - Fenix 250cc #2 (Korean made)
Option 5 - http://imgur.com/a/ESYZM - Supermotos ¨Brozz¨ 250cc (Chinese made)

We are looking to pick the best of these 5 options. They all cost just about the same so we are not sensitive price ($1,500 - $1,700)

Some of the key differences are balanced motors vs unbalanced. Is this something we should be concerned about? Also, the Fenix has a radiator, and none of the other bikes have radiators. We are thinking this may help prevent overheating and take us longer distance in comparison to something like the Montero which does not have a radiator.

Does no radiator mean we will have to stop every 4-5 hours to let the bike cool down?

**side note** the dealer also mentioned that the Montero has better chassis and manufacturing (aluminum) than the other bikes given it´s made in Brazil.

We would really appreciate your input on these options. Thank you all for being so helpful! :)

FYI, we´re documenting our entire journey, you will be sure to see the final video and photos in a few months!

[humanbeing]

Option 1 - http://imgur.com/a/LDUUU - Pegasus 250cc (Korean made)...
Option 1: LP6 = Haojian . They branded some of their bike as "Sukida"
http://www.sukidacycle.com/ProductShow.asp?ID=241 From official picture it's OHC (MD33 http://blog.inmycab.com/xr200rmatome/761/ clone) machine unlike other that uses "steroid" pushrod machine

[kevinballa]

Option 1 - http://imgur.com/a/LDUUU - Pegasus 250cc (Korean made)...
Option 1: LP6 = Haojian . They branded some of their bike as "Sukida"
http://www.sukidacycle.com/ProductShow.asp?ID=241 From official picture it's OHC (MD33 http://blog.inmycab.com/xr200rmatome/761/ clone) machine unlike other that uses "steroid" pushrod machine

I wasn´t very clear on this :oops: . So option 1 has good reputation? Doesn't sound like steroid powered is positive for long distance?! :)

[SpudRider]

I don't think you need a 250cc engine to make your trip. ;) Do those bikes truly have 250cc engines? Sometimes the Chinese label bikes with 223cc engines as 250cc motorcycles. :roll:

I agree with Katoranger. I would place my trust in an air cooled, Chinese motorcycle with a 200cc engine. ;) I am unfamiliar with all the motorcycles you mentioned in your post.

Spud :)

[humanbeing]

...agree with Katoranger. I would place my trust in an air cooled, Chinese motorcycle with a 200cc engine...
11/F (http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&prev=_t&sl=auto&tl=en&twu=1&u=http://family.saycoo.com/viewthread.php%3Ftid%3D269889%26page%3D1%26authori d%3D176114&usg=ALkJrhhiQips5a2DmCAT60njkI_5raG2uw) in Taiwanese forum tells what's the limit of these "Chonda"

[Weldangrind]

The honourable Mr. Humanbeing doesn't care for the "steroid pushrod" engines, but I love 'em. I've had excellent luck with all of mine, as have my friends. Mine is a 200cc pushrod in an atv, and I've punished it with no consequence (yet).

[humanbeing]

The honourable Mr. Humanbeing doesn't care for the "steroid pushrod" engines, but I love 'em. I've had excellent luck with all of mine, as have my friends. Mine is a 200cc pushrod in an atv, and I've punished it with no consequence (yet).
Too many sad story about that air-cool 230 in HUBB ... :D It burns more gas BUT the top speed isn't that far from the little brothers...

[kevinballa]

Alright folks, we did some more walking around today at the shops and spoke with some repair shops and pizza delivery men and everyone seems to have a different opinion. However, I think we´re set on the Montero 250cc after some feedback from a trusted moto rental shop. What are your first impressions of the Montero?

[FastDoc]

To me that looks like a perfectly good generic Honda clone 8) . In some ways looks nicer than most, and has Kenda tires, a plus. It lacks a tach which is no biggie. Indeed even the speedometer is a Honda XL clone. :P

BTW I agree with Weld. For all the little problems Chinabikes have. Nuts, bolts, vibration, electrical etc, the motors tend to be solid performers. 8)

The little problems you can/diagnose/treat/prevent pretty easily. There is a thread here on D/S bike preparation and setup. :P

[kevinballa]

Thanks for the advice! Looking forward to buying it tomorrow.

Been reading through some of the prevention and preparation tips, and came across a site of someone doing a similar route to us who had trouble with all three of his bikes (Kawasaki 650KLRs) at the same time:

But we burned up the motors on all three motorcycles. We ended up sending them back to Santa Cruz in a truck (thus the last picture). Apparently, dust got into the motors through the air filters and ruined the pistons and rings. http://www.pbase.com/beamsclan/moto

How common is this? Hard to believe all three of them had the same exact problem and had to cancel their trip as a result. Does this usually happen in dust storms, riding in mud, or ?? Also should we consider replacing the air filter with a premium air filter as well? Thanks all! :roll:

[SpudRider]

Alright folks, we did some more walking around today at the shops and spoke with some repair shops and pizza delivery men and everyone seems to have a different opinion. However, I think we´re set on the Montero 250cc after some feedback from a trusted moto rental shop. What are your first impressions of the Montero?
I'm concerned the Montero 250 doesn't have a mud flap for the rear wheel. :roll: Without a mud flap the piston shaft of the shock absorber will carry mud past the oil seal, ruining the seal. The shock absorber will then leak oil and fail, resulting in a "pogo stick" which lacks any rebound damping. :( In my opinion, an oversight of this manner in a "dual sport" motorcycle casts doubt on the entire design of the bike. :?

Spud :roll:

[Weldangrind]

Excellent point about the air filter, Kevin. If you use a decent foam filter with quality filter oil, it shouldn't let any dust in. Here's my favourite: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/42mm-Air-Filter-Cleaner-250cc-ATV-Quad-Dirt-Pit-Bike-/320889859012?pt=Motors_ATV_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4ab686abc4

[kevinballa]

Alright folks, we did some more walking around today at the shops and spoke with some repair shops and pizza delivery men and everyone seems to have a different opinion. However, I think we´re set on the Montero 250cc after some feedback from a trusted moto rental shop. What are your first impressions of the Montero?
I'm concerned the Montero 250 doesn't have a mud flap for the rear wheel. :roll: Without a mud flap the piston shaft of the shock absorber will carry mud past the oil seal, ruining the seal. The shock absorber will then leak oil and fail, resulting in a "pogo stick" which lacks any rebound damping. :( In my opinion, an oversight of this manner in a "dual sport" motorcycle casts doubt on the entire design of the bike. :?

Spud :roll:

Wow - really good point about the mud flap. Could you please post a photo of what you mean? Do any of the options we posted above have said mud flap?

Also, how easy would it be to rig something to protect our rear suspension from mud? Would really appreciate the help! -Kevin :lol:

[SpudRider]

Alright folks, we did some more walking around today at the shops and spoke with some repair shops and pizza delivery men and everyone seems to have a different opinion. However, I think we´re set on the Montero 250cc after some feedback from a trusted moto rental shop. What are your first impressions of the Montero?
I'm concerned the Montero 250 doesn't have a mud flap for the rear wheel. :roll: Without a mud flap the piston shaft of the shock absorber will carry mud past the oil seal, ruining the seal. The shock absorber will then leak oil and fail, resulting in a "pogo stick" which lacks any rebound damping. :( In my opinion, an oversight of this manner in a "dual sport" motorcycle casts doubt on the entire design of the bike. :?

Spud :roll:
Wow - really good point about the mud flap. Could you please post a photo of what you mean? Do any of the options we posted above have said mud flap?

Also, how easy would it be to rig something to protect our rear suspension from mud? Would really appreciate the help! -Kevin :lol:
You can learn of my personal experience regarding mud flaps in the following thread. ;)

http://chinariders.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=10050

Here's a photograph of my Zong with a homemade mud flap. :)

http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/spudrider/YamaZong%20Mud%20Flap/trimmedleftsidemudflap.jpg

Here's a photograph of my Zong without the mud flap.

http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/qq146/spudrider/YamaZong%20Mud%20Flap/XT225SwingarmConversion036.jpg

After many thousands of miles, my original mud flap fell off my bike. ;) I strongly suggest you don't buy any "dual sport" motorcycle so poorly designed it does not have a mud flap! 8O This glaring omission is undoubtedly indicative of other, even graver design flaws with that motorcycle. ;) Once again, I encourage you to purchase a 200cc, air cooled, Chinese motorcycle. ;)

Spud :)

[Weldangrind]

Zip ties and a rubber mud flap would do the trick. Even plastic from a large water container would work well. Ask me how I know.

[SpudRider]

You can also employ an empty gallon jug of motor oil or antifreeze. ;) However, I still think the omission of a mud flap on a dual sport motorcycle is a glaring error which is indicative of a generally, poorly designed bike. :(

Spud :?

[kevinballa]

Thanks to pointing to that post Spud. Quick question - it looks like all the bikes are missing a mud flap in back no? Were there any that you noticed had a mud flap to protect the rear suspension?

[Weldangrind]

Stuff like that is common on China bikes. Some simple prep goes a long way.

[FastDoc]

With all respect to Spud's advise, I'd just make a mud flap and call it good and enjoy the ride. :P

I don't think it shows poor design, as i don't think these bikes are designed. :wink:

I believe them to be assembled from semi-identical nearly random parts from innumerable manufactures from across China. 8)

"What kind of rear wheel shall we use Commrade?"

"Look you peasant at the warehouse filled with Brand Yang rear wheels! Use those!"

[SpudRider]

Perhaps I overreacted to the lack of a mud flap; however, it certainly is a design error to consider, and correct. ;)

The post to which I referred considers different options for fabricating a mud flap. I suggest you look at the bikes you are considering, and decide for yourself which bike would most easily accept a fabricated mud flap. You certainly do need a mud flap to prevent damage to the shock absorber. ;)

Spud :)

[kevinballa]

Thanks for the advice all! We ended up going with the Pegasus. So far so good, but we´re only a day in :)

Will be sure to let you all know how it goes!

[SpudRider]

It appears to me the Pegasus bike has a mud flap! :) I think you made a good choice. :)

Please start a new thread in our Ride Reports Forum! We would enjoy traveling along with you, and we will be glad to help you if you require assistance. :)

Spud :)

[humanbeing]

Thanks for the advice all! We ended up going with the Pegasus...
Md33 (& clone) basics <Quoted from authorized Honda dealer in Japan http://www.ride-inc.net/file/32/data.pdf >:
Oil: 1.0L / 1.2L (disassembled) | Valve clearance: IN/EX 0.1mm | Idle(rpm): 1400 | Float height :18.5mm

[katoranger]

I thought the pegasus appeared to be a slightly better built bike. The swingarm looks beefier.