2017 venom x20 125cc lifan

[imapdog]

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[imapdog]

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i used part of this two piece kit.
flipped tail light upside down.
all four bolts lined up.
couldnt keep rack that came from venom.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vagabond-Motorsports-Honda-Grom-2017-Fender-Eliminator/332287570918?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2648&redirect=mobile

[imapdog]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Honda-MSX125-GROM-428-Conversion-Front-Or-Rear-Sprockets-Multiple-Sizes/401365471570?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=670987434591&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&redirect=mobile
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/17Tooth-428-Pitch-17mm-Front-Counter-Sprocket-Pit-Dirt-Bike-ATV-Taotao-Lifan-YX/182462145763?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2648&redirect=mobile
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/JT-428-HDR-110-Link-Heavy-Duty-Drive-Chain-428HDR-JTC428HDR110SL-1220-0144/262387786421?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&redirect=mobile
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[imapdog]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B01FS6M3W8?psc=1&ref=yo_pop_mb_yo_pop_mb_pd_t2
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kept vm22 carb as is. only changed jet to 115. bolted it up. fired up nice!
idle was right on too! havent gotten her up to top speed but think i need to
go down to 110 jet. not completely sure yet. exhaust didnt work out and jetted it for new exuast that didnt fit. the air mixture is on the bottom and adjustable from the outside.
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the mounting bracket for the emissions stuff was used perfectly for the block off plate.
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[imapdog]

i really think this thing will sound good and go faster with better exhaust.
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pics were taken before sprocket change

[imapdog]

i purchased low mount exhaust for grom:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/SC-Low-Mount-Exhaust-Full-System-stainless-steel-Honda-grom-msx125-msxSf-12-17/152248413143?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
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it did not fit in two ways:
1) the Spigot-collar is too short
2) it seems as if it angles off a honda grom engine directly down.
my 125cc lifan on the venom x20 has a slight angle toward the
rear. other words....a 90 degree bend off engine is grom, and
the x20 needs maybe 100 degree bend. not sure if its a difference
of engine being mounted differently or the exhaust hole on engine
is in fact at a different angle from grom to x20.
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i have read where a pipe adapter fixes a common problem with klx to
honda with:
http://shop.pitsterpro.com/nccpipeadapter.aspx
or maybe stacking some 2-3 Crushable exhaust gaskets:
http://tboltusa.com/store/tech.php?pID=85/Exhaust+Pipe+Adapters

all said if i can change the depth of my collar and change the angle,
my purchased exhaust would fit.
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[Weldangrind]

Is it possible to trim the collar to meet the exhaust port angle?

[imapdog]

Is it possible to trim the collar to meet the exhaust port angle?

maybe, if the collar was longer. it is too short to begin with.
i like these possibilities, but trial and error is expensive:
https://tboltusa.com/store/honda-50-z50-atc70-monkey-bikes-side-out-muffler-p-2293.html
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Honda-Z50-Exhaust-Muffler-Z50-MONKEY-Stainless-Steel-Z-50-Skyteam-Piranha-side/253153900879?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
wish i had detailed specs.

[imapdog]

i ordered msx 125 exhaust and didnt fit. this is why.
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[Weldangrind]

Do you have access to a welder? You could grind off the weld that secures the existing collar and then weld a deeper collar in place. That would allow you to trim the edge to any angle you wish. You'll need to paint the collar, but that's NBD.

[imapdog]

i may need more than one 32mm crush washer, how many is using too many?
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it does barely touch frame where engine mount bolt runs thru, but it seals perfect at exhaust port without any crush washers. if this fits tomorrow, can i claim some sort of a gorilla bike status?
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came with hardware when ad said no hardware.
now i have more crush washers. just enough gap filler i need to make this work.
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[imapdog]

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i think i will try some tube spacers and long bolt for
mounting this pipe here, any better ideas?:)
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[culcune]

Awesome! These bikes are very, very versatile, kind of like the bike that came before them. The CT70 clones had numerous parts that would interchange with real CT70s. Their 125cc engines were essentially pit bike engines, so many upgrade parts, and/or engine swaps (140, 160, 190,) could be done with those.

These bikes are close enough to Groms where many parts will interchange, but are also close to pit bikes in the engine department, as you found out with your Piranha exhaust. I look forward to seeing these bikes in the months to come; you guys seem to be younger than those who bought CT70 replicas, so I envision many upgrades and engine swaps.

One question I have been meaning to ask--the initial batch of Boom! (aka Baodiao) Vaders seem to be like Hawks in that members had several things to do to them to get them going. Some were on the verge of giving up, until they got the love and support here and voila, theirs were up running. Your bike is recent, so did you find minor niggles and issues when assembling it? Perhaps with feedback they have gotten these down?

[Weldangrind]

Do you need to re-bend the bracket to line up with the mounting hole underneath? Hard to tell from the pic angle.

[imapdog]

the already welded on bracket on the exhaust pipe lined up perfectly to the unused threaded hole on bottom of the engine. i went to hardware store and bought 1" pipe spacer (hardened), bolt, and two rubber washers. very easy and a bonus to not makeshift anything! been contemplating on knocking out the baffle.

[Weldangrind]

How does it sounds now?

[imapdog]

it sounds pretty kewl! but not as obnoxiously loud as i wanted and expected from the aggressive look of the pipe. i have zero experience in exhaust, should i knock off this baffle screen(i know i can cut it off, but what is the tube thing behind it? baffle tube? i dont see a way to remove it by bolt or weld. how are they removed?
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[wlfpck]

it sounds pretty kewl! but not as obnoxiously loud as i wanted and expected from the aggressive look of the pipe. i have zero experience in exhaust, please advise if i should remove this baffle thing, it is an exhaust made for 50cc honda z50 stock or big bore. and not worried about messing up my carb settings as i havent finalized the settings yet.


If you remove the baffles, it should be a bit louder. I would use a wire and poke it through first to make sure that it is just a baffle and to "see" what is actually in there.

If it is just a plate with holes in it, then should be fine. Though I don't know what affect it will have. May be a little louder.

[Weldangrind]

I'm surprised that there's no bolt that secures the baffle. My next guess is that it was spot-welded in and then the weld was ground down before chrome plating. If you can find the spot weld, you could drill it out. You could then remove the baffle, tap the baffle housing with threads and then secure it with a stainless bolt. Depends how much you like risk.

[imapdog]

I'm surprised that there's no bolt that secures the baffle. My next guess is that it was spot-welded in and then the weld was ground down before chrome plating. If you can find the spot weld, you could drill it out. You could then remove the baffle, tap the baffle housing with threads and then secure it with a stainless bolt. Depends how much you like risk.
at the very least i will cut that baffle screen off. maybe just maybe a clue resides behind it.

[imapdog]

i can get this thing up to 55mph gps speed pretty quickly(i myself weigh 200lb and realy look like a gorilla on it). that being said...if there were another gear, i truly think it would reach above 60mph . is my only option for 60+mph is a completely different engine with 5speed bc engine can do it as a 125cc? i am running 17t 428 front, stock 34t 428 rear, vm22 115 jet, and good flowing custom exhaust. i am mostly happy with this bike getting to 55mph fairly quick. credit to brisk spark plug! i would say faster to 55mph for a 125cc stock engine than expected, but always want more right? i would ride it more where i live bc most roads are 55mph getting to the places i go with no back road alternates and riding at 55 is right on the beginning of the red-line range. i would feel safe at 60 mph on this ride without riding the redline range.

[JerryHawk250]

A word of caution using those bolt holes for mounting anything. Make sure the bolts you use do not bottom out when tightening. They will bust through easily. We had a member on here this has happened to. http://www.chinariders.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=12343&d=1521901303

[imapdog]

A word of caution using those bolt holes for mounting anything. Make sure the bolts you use do not bottom out when tightening. They will bust through easily. We had a member on here this has happened to. http://www.chinariders.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=12343&d=1521901303

thanks for looking out. i did buy two bolts just in case this would issue. i used a toothpick to measure hole depth. i think i used a 1.25" bolt when 1" was the gap using a 1" pipe spacer and two rubber washers. i remember i used half of the depth inside the holes.....i have learned that working on cars.......very good point though!

[Weldangrind]

i can get this thing up to 55mph gps speed pretty quickly(i myself weigh 200lb and realy look like a gorilla on it). that being said...if there were another gear, i truly think it would reach above 60mph . is my only option for 60+mph is a completely different engine with 5speed bc engine can do it as a 125cc? i am running 17t 428 front, stock 34t 428 rear, vm22 115 jet, and good flowing custom exhaust. i am mostly happy with this bike getting to 55mph fairly quick. credit to brisk spark plug! i would say faster to 55mph for a 125cc stock engine than expected, but always want more right? i would ride it more where i live bc most roads are 55mph getting to the places i go with no back road alternates and riding at 55 is right on the beginning of the red-line range. i would feel safe at 60 mph on this ride without riding the redline range.

Does this match your countershaft sprocket?

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[imapdog]

Does this match your countershaft sprocket?

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yes, it will mount on the shaft, but my 17t 428 is maxed out in the overall diameter measurement for fitting. not sure of the 16t 420 diameter measurement.....

[Weldangrind]

Is it maxed out because of the cover? If so, how do you feel about running without the cover?

[imapdog]

Is it maxed out because of the cover? If so, how do you feel about running without the cover?
i am not 100% sure. i will take a peek tonight. and some pics. i do know that pushing the bike backwards moving around in shop i hear chain barely clanking sometimes on the tail end of cover at bottom.

[imapdog]

Is it maxed out because of the cover? If so, how do you feel about running without the cover?

i didnt get a chance to capture pic with chain on, but i dont think its possibe for any more room than the 17t 428 already takes up.
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[Mowgli]

How are you liking the carb you got off amazon? I see it listed as a 26 but is it actually 24?
Was it all plug and play or did you have to get anything else besides that?
I’m looking at getting it for a taotao hellcat. I’m guessing it’s the same as the Mikuni ones?

[imapdog]

How are you liking the carb you got off amazon? I see it listed as a 26 but is it actually 24?
Was it all plug and play or did you have to get anything else besides that?
I’m looking at getting it for a taotao hellcat. I’m guessing it’s the same as the Mikuni ones?


not sure what the kit is selling now but mine was a mikuni vm22. being 26mm measurement at venturi and 22mm out into intake manifold. no extras needed. all needed was included except desired jets. i like these mikuni carbs.

[Mowgli]

not sure what the kit is selling now but mine was a mikuni vm22. being 26mm measurement at venturi and 22mm out into intake manifold. no extras needed. all needed was included except desired jets. i like these mikuni carbs.

Is this the one you ordered? I’m not seeing anything about it being 22mm it’s just saying 26mm. I just want to be sure I get the right one

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01FS6M3W8?tag=viglink28144-20

[Chinabike]

Is this the one you ordered? I’m not seeing anything about it being 22mm it’s just saying 26mm. I just want to be sure I get the right one

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01FS6M3W8?tag=viglink28144-20

I was wonder about that carb also. I don't think its a real Mikuni 22mm but seems like the one a lot are getting these Grom clones.

I was looking at that one or this one. Anyone know the difference between them?

https://www.amazon.com/Mikuni-Round-Slide-Carburetor-VM22-133/dp/B003CK3IJK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1523288291&sr=8-1&keywords=Mikuni+22mm+VM

[Hellkitty]

I was wonder about that carb also. I don't think its a real Mikuni 22mm but seems like the one a lot are getting these Grom clones.

I was looking at that one or this one. Anyone know the difference between them?

https://www.amazon.com/Mikuni-Round-Slide-Carburetor-VM22-133/dp/B003CK3IJK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1523288291&sr=8-1&keywords=Mikuni+22mm+VM

What is real and what is fake who knows. The carb in the link is similar to a vm20 i bought years ago. It does not have a butterfly choke, it has a choke "circuit". If memory serves me right, you can also change the main jet by removing the bolt on the float bowl. The biggest issue for me was trying to find an intake to fit it. If you look at the link below, the picture that shows the side where the intake mounts, the mounting holes are inline with the center of the flange, every intake I've seen, the mounting holes are slightly off center to fit the so called fake carbs.



Here is an interesting thread comparing the two.

https://www.oldminibikes.com/forum/mini-bike-discussion/139109-mikuni-chikuni-comparison.html

[Chinabike]

Sort of confused now, sorry. I just made a new HELLCAT Carb thread.

Hellkitty does you Mikuni look like the one in the bay link you posted?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/161240922802?rmvSB=true

Did you use the stock intake? If not, what did you do with that vacuum line that comes out of the stock intake?

Must intakes i have seen don't have that vacuum outlet?

So would it be better to buy this whole set up? But it's a 26mm?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01FS6M3W8?tag=viglink28144-20

[wlfpck]

Get a UNI breather filter... or leave it open.

All that hose is, is the crankcase vent. I have a small uni filter on mine.

[Hammertime]

Did you get carb to work with out new cable mine pull up in that spot

[Arcstriker29]

I have a Hellcat, with a 26mm carb and 26mm intake pipe, without the vacuum line, I just ran my line from the crankcase up with the inline filter still attached so it didn't get dirt inside, (not sure if this is ok or not) I did have to flip the new pipe around some my carb is in the front of the engine, but worked. As far as gearing goes, the 17T is the biggest you can go with up front, however my hellcat came with a 34T in the rear and I swapped it with a 32T. I was pushing 60 mph around 7800 RPMs on flat ground (I'm 5'8 130 lbs) I think my valves need to be adjusted tho, because even with stock carb set the best it could be set wouldn't idle once warmed up, then when I installed the new 26mm carb same problem... I also just got a 27mm carb and have a 27mm intake pipe coming, the hole in the engine is 27mm max, so I figured I'd give it everything I could... I'll keep you posted... my new exhaust is coming next week, I already I know I'll have to fabricate it to work, but hopefully not too bad... we'll see. Your bike looks nice, I like these bikes because there is always something else than can be done either for performance or for looks...

[imapdog]

that amazon link for the carb kit i posted isnt a good kit. i must have gotten lucky with the first one i ordered bc it ran perfect on my vader. the next two i ordered weren't good, anywhere close, even after adjustments...i wont order that one anymore....i will spend the extra change for the genuine mikuni. the second two i ordered came with wrong sized gaskets. beware

[imapdog]

didnt even know these were avail.....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/350864195159?_trksid=p2380057.m570.l5999&_trkparms=gh1g%3DI350864195159.N36.S1.R1.TR3

[Mowgli]

that amazon link for the carb kit i posted isnt a good kit. i must have gotten lucky with the first one i ordered bc it ran perfect on my vader. the next two i ordered weren't good, anywhere close, even after adjustments...i wont order that one anymore....i will spend the extra change for the genuine mikuni. the second two i ordered came with wrong sized gaskets. beware

Are you talking about the paper gasket or the plastic one? I’ve been running that amazon one also. The only issue I’ve had it that the bolts were to long for the intake to bolt to the engine. I’m pretty sure I bottomed them out. Hopefully I didn’t push through into the engine case though

[Arcstriker29]

didnt even know these were avail.....

https://www.ebay.com/itm/350864195159?_trksid=p2380057.m570.l5999&_trkparms=gh1g%3DI350864195159.N36.S1.R1.TR3

I bought one of these 18T but it’s too big, it won’t fit with the chain on it. If you want more gearing then the 17T, you’ll have to step down the back sprocket. Like I mentioned before I have the 17T in the front, and swapped out the 34T for a 32T in the rear.

[imapdog]

Are you talking about the paper gasket or the plastic one? I’ve been running that amazon one also. The only issue I’ve had it that the bolts were to long for the intake to bolt to the engine. I’m pretty sure I bottomed them out. Hopefully I didn’t push through into the engine case though

paper ones, one was too small and other was too large, go figure! and the bolts i used for the plastic spacer connection.

[Chinabike]

Are you talking about the paper gasket or the plastic one? I’ve been running that amazon one also. The only issue I’ve had it that the bolts were to long for the intake to bolt to the engine. I’m pretty sure I bottomed them out. Hopefully I didn’t push through into the engine case though

Same. Came with wrong gasket size had to cut it wider. Carb is working good but i hate it with bottom fuel/air screw. i think i might get the vm22 with it on the side.

Ya you need to change to intake bolt size, the stock intake has a longer base. No one told me that :hmm: you probably did what i did, but i did it more extreme and snapped my bolt.

[Chinabike]

I bought one of these 18T but it’s too big, it won’t fit with the chain on it. If you want more gearing then the 17T, you’ll have to step down the back sprocket. Like I mentioned before I have the 17T in the front, and swapped out the 34T for a 32T in the rear.

you got the 18t to fit on? isn't the case to small?

[Mowgli]

paper ones, one was too small and other was too large, go figure! and the bolts i used for the plastic spacer connection.

Where does that paper one even go? I used the original paper one between the head and intake manifold. I then used the plastic one between the intake manifold and carb. Does it go with the plastic one? I noticed the bolt pattern didn’t match to go to the head.

[Chinabike]

Where does that paper one even go? I used the original paper one between the head and intake manifold. I then used the plastic one between the intake manifold and carb. Does it go with the plastic one? I noticed the bolt pattern didn’t match to go to the head.

It goes with the plastic one. But i didn't use either on top

[imapdog]

i have been putting the paper one on the intake engine-port when in a kit, bc i usually tear the factory gasket while removing stock intake pipe. i ordered 3 kits, they sent a different sized paper gasket each time... beware

[Weldangrind]

Put a thin film of grease on both sides of the gasket before installation. That'll prevent tearing if you even need to remove the intake tube again.

[imapdog]

i take back at least half of what i complained about with the kit in previous post. the gaskets are potentially wrong size but the rest is right on point for 125cc. i had bad factory(too tight) tappet valve clearance. wow i was chasing ghosts bc of this. once the valve clearance was set. it ran like a champ. i really really love this setup all around x20. 15 pilot 105 main on the kit is right on point! all throttle parameters are good with all speeds, and no smoke or smells. smooth quick revs makes me happy.

[Arcstriker29]

Yeah setting my valves made a huge difference, idled much better, but I did the same thing, swapped carbs, jet sizes, and finally checked my valves, and that was the problem all along. I had an issue recently where my throttle needle clip decided to come off, which dropped the needle down and blocked the main jet, causing it to bog right out after half throttle and up. I kept cleaning the main jet scratching my head wondering what the problem could be, finally took the carb off and set it down and the needle fell right out the bottom... fixed that and she’s running great now. Glad you found your troubles tho... definitely learn a lot messing with these bikes, but fun as hell when things are going good.

[scoot newb]

@impadog

That exhaust is sick. When you put on the new carb did you have to put on a new manifold too?

https://www.amazon.com/GooDeal-mower-Carburetor-Filter-110cc/dp/B01FS6M3W8/ I was a little weirded out because it said lawn mower. But I guess a carb is a carb. And is it the 'venturi 22mm to 26mm at intake kit' part of that kit or a separate manifold?

I'm not sure if I could make the block off plate but maybe the one I have on my tao tao 50 will fit or I could make it fit. I'm not very good at wrenching. I had all I could do to install a BBK and cam on the scooter.

So I am thinking, carb, emissions and fender delete, 17t front sprocket and eventually the Z50 Piranha exhaust. Replacing the engine bolts and lock-tite-ing others I could do but I don't really want to get something that I have to work on all the time. :)

I don't mean to be a copy cat but I can not wrench well and would hate to get parts that are hard to tune or need to be heavily modified to fit and have no way to get feedback.

What is the top speed now?

Thanks

[imapdog]

yes you will need a new manifold and will have to turn it forward. you can also purchase a spinner that will allow to-the-side carb mount, but easier to just face carb forward. be helpful to have spare gaskets, bolts-nuts, and spacers on hand, and seems like the green paper gaskets ones do the best....be careful to not be sent wrong sizes....and be careful of the spacer cracking allowing air.
my learning curve was the pilot jet issues, the main jet was just for the fine tuning for higher speeds, and the needle jet was easily adjustable after the pilot is set first...

my vader II came with a block off plate that was mounting the emissions stuff. so i relocated it to the block off area....you will get clink noises if you don't use a good one....re use the gasket that came on it too...

once you figure out the voodoo needed on carbs in general, you wont work on it as much as many fear....yes there are duds delivered like bad gas tank seals whatnot, but for the most part the vader II is reliable once you got a good carb setup....i have gone thru 9 of them....

[scoot newb]

Cool. I am sorta familiar with jetting from the scoot.

I did it. I ordered a 2018 Hellcat. I wanted the Venom but didn't want to pay more than 1,100. XD . Do you know if the Hellcat has the unused threaded hole on bottom of the engine you mounted the pipe to?

I also read a post from a Hellcat owner who says it does not have the emissions stuff on it. Either way I am comfortable with removing that. I will prolly have to put it back on to pass inspection.

Thanks for your time.

[Chinabike]

Cool. I am sorta familiar with jetting from the scoot.

I did it. I ordered a 2018 Hellcat. I wanted the Venom but didn't want to pay more than 1,100. XD . Do you know if the Hellcat has the unused threaded hole on bottom of the engine you mounted the pipe to?

I also read a post from a Hellcat owner who says it does not have the emissions stuff on it. Either way I am comfortable with removing that. I will prolly have to put it back on to pass inspection.

Thanks for your time.

The hellcat has 4 unused holeS under engine. But i don't know if its a good idea to bolt anything to them.

Hellcat comes with emission stuff/airbox but nothing connected to the engine that you have to block off.

Get a DAX/z50 exhaust pipe.
vm22 carb and jets
pod filter.
17t (optional)
carb spinner (optional but diff worth it)

and you are set.

[RedCrowRides]

You can use those 4 bolt holes as long as you measure carefully and dont bottom the bolts out ,I used two of them to install this anodized aluminum skidplate : https://www.ebay.com/itm/4-Stroke-Dirt-Pit-Bike-ENGINE-Skid-Plate-Crf-50-Parts-50-125cc-LIFAN-SSR/160500444689?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649



Be sure and use spacers or stack washers to make sure you dont bottom the bolts out and "push through" or pull the threads out and you will be fine.They have a reasonably deep hole so it shouldn't be too hard to measure and get it right. Imapdog mounted his exhaust to them as well , he also used spacers, i'm sure other hardware stores have them but i can tell you for sure Tractor Supplys hardware section has all kinds of spacers ,and you can always just stack washers if it comes to that, ain't anyone gonna see em under there no how lol :)

[Vx21rsjohn]

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i think i will try some tube spacers and long bolt for
mounting this pipe here, any better ideas?:)
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Do you have any sound clips of the exhaust?