So, Magician or Hawk? Tough choice!

[pcbisnice]

Hey all! I have been reading about these bikes for the last few weeks while in quarantine. I am 5ft 7 inches. I have been riding my whole life. I really like both these bikes. The hawk seems proven. It seems there is readily available parts and performance mods available. What i don't like, is the seat height. I used to own a 600r honda and while i could ride it, it was not easy to handle. I noticed the magician has a much more friendly seat height. I also think it looks much better. I also know i can lower the height of the hawk with a new shock. Would it be low enough? My lady might ride some times, and i think the hawks bigger frame might be better for that. Are there lots of mods for the magician? I am a speed junky and I will be buying any mods that are available. I seen plenty for the hawk. Are they the same engine? Same horsepower? I could really use some suggestions and insight guys! thank you!

[Biker_Andy]

Honestly none of the Chinese bikes are terribly fast even heavily modified. That said if your new to dirt they are a cheap learning platform. All CG engines (Hawk, TT, Magician, Brozz and others) basically have the same modifications and parts are interchangeable, head, carb and exhaust. China has cloned other engines that have better performance like in the SSR bikes and perhaps pitser pro but they cost more initially but likely don't need modifications for the desired performance.

[Biker_Andy]

Here are a few seat hights of some of the Chinese bikes

[Megadan]

I have my Hawk lowered in the back roughly about 3 inches which makes the seat height close to the same as that of the Magician. No loss of suspension travel, no bottoming out. handles and rides great. The Hawk seat is also very thick foam in the main riders position, so there is room there to cut it down if desired, or you could install the seat concepts lower seat for the TT250 (it bolts right on). Which reduces the height by about another 2 inches for the rider. Those two combined would have a seat height right around 30-31 inches.

The Magician is a lighter bike, and it is definitely better suited to smaller riders than it is to 6ft 4 monsters like me. That lighter construction also means that the frame is a little less durable, and a few people on here that used theirs off road have reported cracking the frame at some of the welds.

As a road bike the Magician will do just fine, and there is a decent aftermarket out there for them as well. A lot of the parts for them will generally have to be ordered from sites like Taobao, Chinahao, or Aliexpress, but they are out there. As a whole though the Hawk has more support and availability of modifications.

The engine is identical between the two. The only difference is the side covers for the Hawk say "HAWK" and the Magician says "Magician"

Some other drawbacks of the magician compared to the Hawk would be it's small fuel tank size (about half the size), and very limited options as far as sprocket sizes go for the rear wheel.

The Hawk is much more of a bike that can be tailored to suit whatever your heart desires.

Other options would be bikes like the Brozz 250 or TBR7 (same price range as Hawk/Magician). These bikes have smaller 19 inch front and 17 inch rear wheels, and as a result about 1 inch lower seat heights. The same lowering can also be done to them as done to the Hawk.

[pcbisnice]

I have my Hawk lowered in the back roughly about 3 inches which makes the seat height close to the same as that of the Magician. No loss of suspension travel, no bottoming out. handles and rides great. The Hawk seat is also very thick foam in the main riders position, so there is room there to cut it down if desired, or you could install the seat concepts lower seat for the TT250 (it bolts right on). Which reduces the height by about another 2 inches for the rider. Those two combined would have a seat height right around 30-31 inches.

The Magician is a lighter bike, and it is definitely better suited to smaller riders than it is to 6ft 4 monsters like me. That lighter construction also means that the frame is a little less durable, and a few people on here that used theirs off road have reported cracking the frame at some of the welds.

As a road bike the Magician will do just fine, and there is a decent aftermarket out there for them as well. A lot of the parts for them will generally have to be ordered from sites like Taobao, Chinahao, or Aliexpress, but they are out there. As a whole though the Hawk has more support and availability of modifications.

The engine is identical between the two. The only difference is the side covers for the Hawk say "HAWK" and the Magician says "Magician"

Some other drawbacks of the magician compared to the Hawk would be it's small fuel tank size (about half the size), and very limited options as far as sprocket sizes go for the rear wheel.

The Hawk is much more of a bike that can be tailored to suit whatever your heart desires.

Other options would be bikes like the Brozz 250 or TBR7 (same price range as Hawk/Magician). These bikes have smaller 19 inch front and 17 inch rear wheels, and as a result about 1 inch lower seat heights. The same lowering can also be done to them as done to the Hawk.

Thank you for the in depth response! Great info. I could definitely do with a 30-31 inch seat height. I think i will go with the hawk pre-order as I don't think anyone has them in stock at this moment.

I think i saw your thread on lowering the hawk. Or at least, i think it was you? I believe I read 280mm. Do you have a link to the one you used? I see million on ebay but i am unsure of how the mounts look and measure out till i get it arrives.

Side question: Do you happen to know the distance between the mounting bolts for the intake manifold? I was looking for one on ebay to fit an aftermarket carb. Thank you for your help.

[Megadan]

Thank you for the in depth response! Great info. I could definitely do with a 30-31 inch seat height. I think i will go with the hawk pre-order as I don't think anyone has them in stock at this moment.

I think i saw your thread on lowering the hawk. Or at least, i think it was you? I believe I read 280mm. Do you have a link to the one you used? I see million on ebay but i am unsure of how the mounts look and measure out till i get it arrives.

Side question: Do you happen to know the distance between the mounting bolts for the intake manifold? I was looking for one on ebay to fit an aftermarket carb. Thank you for your help.

Yes, that thread on lowering the Hawk was mine. It was a 280mm Fast Ace shock combined with a Brozz swing arm. Without the Brozz swing arm you would want about a 295mm rear shock.

I can't link the exact seller I bought mine from as they are out of stock. This seller, and another one, both have them listed about 20 bucks more. https://www.amazon.com/FASTACE-RACING-BDA-01AR-BS-22AR-NEW/dp/B081VVX57N/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=280mm+fastace+1000lb&qid=1589677636&sr=8-1

To install any of the aftermarket shocks you will need spacers for the top and bottom mounts. Thankfully these premade ones are cheap. I used the 19mm O.D. for both.
For the top mount you will need two 5mm wide spacers.
https://www.aluminumspacers.com/spacers-by-metric-hole/10mm-hole?length=45
For the bottom mounts, two 10mm spacers.
https://www.aluminumspacers.com/spacers-by-metric-hole/10mm-hole?length=63

I would say lower the bike first and if it still won't work out then do the seat next. My girlfriend is 5'7 and she can mount and dismount my Hawk with little trouble, and even with the preload set for my big fat butt she can get her feet to touch the ground, even if she is a bit tippy toed. If we set it for her, she could get at least the balls of both feet down.

Intake bolt separation is 61-62mm (you will find both, they both work). Be aware that they are not straight across, but actually offset. You will need an intake that is specifically built for a CG or CB chinese clone, or a CRF 230.

What carb were you wanting to mount?

[pcbisnice]

Yes, that thread on lowering the Hawk was mine. It was a 280mm Fast Ace shock combined with a Brozz swing arm. Without the Brozz swing arm you would want about a 295mm rear shock.

I can't link the exact seller I bought mine from as they are out of stock. This seller, and another one, both have them listed about 20 bucks more. https://www.amazon.com/FASTACE-RACING-BDA-01AR-BS-22AR-NEW/dp/B081VVX57N/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=280mm+fastace+1000lb&qid=1589677636&sr=8-1

To install any of the aftermarket shocks you will need spacers for the top and bottom mounts. Thankfully these premade ones are cheap. I used the 19mm O.D. for both.
For the top mount you will need two 5mm wide spacers.
https://www.aluminumspacers.com/spacers-by-metric-hole/10mm-hole?length=45
For the bottom mounts, two 10mm spacers.
https://www.aluminumspacers.com/spacers-by-metric-hole/10mm-hole?length=63

I would say lower the bike first and if it still won't work out then do the seat next. My girlfriend is 5'7 and she can mount and dismount my Hawk with little trouble, and even with the preload set for my big fat butt she can get her feet to touch the ground, even if she is a bit tippy toed. If we set it for her, she could get at least the balls of both feet down.

Intake bolt separation is 61-62mm (you will find both, they both work). Be aware that they are not straight across, but actually offset. You will need an intake that is specifically built for a CG or CB chinese clone, or a CRF 230.

What carb were you wanting to mount?

Your help is greatly appreciated. I will be placing my pre-order tomorrow!

Not sure on the carb. I was looking at one of the 30mm ones.