XP 200 vs XF 200 performance kits

[trixter]

I have an XP 200. I ordered some performance parts from JP Motorsports and it appears I got parts for an XF 200. Some seem to fit some obviously do not. The invoice listed some of the parts as XF 200. The shop is closed right now but I thought I would ask while I waited for them to reopen in the morning.


It included a K&N air filter to replace the entire air box.
It included a breather because that formerly connected to the airbox.
44 tooth rear sprocket
Finally there was a new exhaust which was supposed to be bolt on.



I ave a problem connecting the replacement air intake system. They provided no directions so I was just kinda winging it. I got a K&N air filter, that was fairly obvious. I got a breather filter, which appears to go on the main engine housing. This leaves a couple hoses I do not know where they go.


One connects to the side of the carb next to the air intake. It is black rubber and cut at an angle. This indicates that it slides into something rather than over something but for the life of me I cannot figure out what. I see nothing that it would slide into. The hose is on the right side directly on the opposite side of the air intake from the fuel input.

There is a T joint on the left side of the bike and one part of the T used to go into the air box. I did not trace it to see where it goes, although it appears to go under the fuel tank to the front somewhere and in the rear by the can that is next to the muffler. Probably part of some emissions something or another, since I live in CA I have to honor the emissions stuff. Since that is replaced with the K&N filter I no longer know what I should connect that to. Presumably I should replace it with a straight connector, does anyone know what I should be doing with this hose?


Before I started I noticed the clear carb bowl overflow hose is just dangling in the middle of the bike. Is that normal or did it come loose from wherever it originally was supposed to go?




Is there any difference between the rear sprockets on a XP vs XF 200? afaik the chain and mounting is all the same so I should be able to put that on without worry. I am wanting to get as much done tonight as possible to reduce downtime.


The exhaust has mounting points on it but they do not line up with my bike. It appears there are enough differences between the xp and xf that the only way to keep this exhaust is to make my own brackets for it. This means I will probably put the stock exhaust back on until a replacement exhaust can be shipped to me.

The show stoppers right now are the mystery hoses.

[david3921]

Trixter, we will need photos on some of this...ok, maybe all.

Just a note (a big one) there are no performance gains to be had on these bikes by replacing the airbox. Even if there were, just replacing the box with a pod filter will cause some problems as you have seen. The carb is supported on both sides. If you remove the airbox the carb will bounce around and rip the intake manifold. I had to replace mine because of a tear and I didn't remove anything. I think that I can trace it to our weather here in Michigan, though. You'll have to fab up some sort of support bracket for the carb if you want to still go with the K&N filter.

Most parts that fit the XF will fit the XP and vice versa. If the sprocket is for an XF, it will fit a XP. Most change the front sprocket to a 16T, however. There are a lot of posts here and on www.mychinamoto.com about these bikes and sprocket changes. I'm running a 16T/44T combo and found it works for me. Some just change the front and keep the back the 48T.

The jet seems pretty big to me. Do a search on that also. Volksjagger blew his motor running that big of a jet. He was also red lining it all of the time also so I'm sure that had a lot to do with it. Not saying you will but a 125 or 127.5 jet has been found to be the optimum jet for these bikes.

Now the pipe. Is it the FMF? If it is, it should just slip on as JPMotorsports was the first (I believe) that put this pipe on these bikes.

[trixter]

Good to know about the jet and carb support. This is a kit that JP Motorsports (who has been favorably reviewd) has.

The exhaust is a pro circuit T4 exhaust.

I did notice that the carb has less support as a result, hadnt thought of it bouncing though.

The hose with a T on it goes from a valve at the very front of the bike to a plastic cylinder at the right rear (near where the original muffler was). I do not know enough about motorcycle engines to know what it is for.


The guy at JP said that either sprocket would give about the same performance gains, and I wanted to leave an option open if I needed more but not rob all hill climbing ability. Since the rear was easier to install I opted for that.

The air intake, exhaust and jet are supposed to be matched on this bike, according to the guy at JP doing only part of that will make the bike run worse but doing all of them is supposed to make it better.


Here are the photos.

The parts before any assembly.
starting at top left:
K&N filter, breather filter, pro circuit muffler
anti-seize grease, jet, header
sticker, connector pipe
http://www.0xdecafbad.com/files/perf/parts.jpg

The hose on the right side of the carb
http://www.0xdecafbad.com/files/perf/right-hose.jpg

The hose on the left side of the bike (connects front of engine at a valve to a box in the rear left)
http://www.0xdecafbad.com/files/perf/left-hose.jpg

The box in the rear that the above hose connects to
http://www.0xdecafbad.com/files/perf/box-left-hose-connects-to.jpg

[Weldangrind]

The fellow Q owners can comment on the hose placement. A large main jet is not going to cause your engine to blow; the air and fuel need to be delivered in the right proportion for good performance, and the 132.5 is in response to the less restrictive air filter. If your main jet was too lean, I'd be concerned, but it is not.

Did they instruct you to oil your new filter?

[trixter]

I have used K&N filters before and have the oil and all. There were no instructions provided of any kind.

You should balance air intake with output, you do need a certain amount of back pressure though.

This jet is likely to have problems at high altitudes, fortunately most of my travel is into the valley and not up the hill. I can go up the hill directly and be at 5000 feet in under 20 minutes and make sure it works there (that is about the altitude that I would ride at where I go camping). But that is after I get it all back together and working again :)

[trixter]

Just got off the phone with JP Motorsports here is what they said.


The hose that is on the right side of the carb is a vent hose and just dangles.

The hose on the left side that is in a T is usually eliminated by placing a straight connector through it. This is part of the CA emissions stuff and what the canister is in the rear of the bike. They did not include a straight tube which is silly.

They said that I have to make a bracket for the muffler. On the phone I was told that this is a bolt on kit, I was not told that it was a "make a bracket and then bolt to that" kit. I find this a little upsetting but I can get some metal at lowes later today and stop by the auto parts place and see about a connector, or just a total length of hose (whichever is cheaper) and replace it.

I think that I will make a braket for the carb that goes between the carb cap (using the 4 screws on the cap already) and connects to where the fuel tank bolts to the frame under the seat. This will be a fairly simple bit of metal with few bends and just a bit of drilling and cutting. I would feel a lot better if there were splash guards for the air filter, its so exposed just sitting there and I really dont like getting my air filter soaked, it tends to not be nice to the engine.

I am so glad I have all the tools for this, I am unsure how many people have a proper shop to fashion brackets for a "bolt on" kit.

I am most displeased with the fact that there is not:
1. instructions
2. replacement hose
3. bracket for the muffler
4. bracket for the carb

If these things existed this kit would be so much easier to install.

[david3921]

Trixter, I hope my comment about about the 132 jet didn't lead you to believe that you will blow your engine. The reason I mentioned it is now you will be able to run at a higher speed with a higher RPM. Volksjagger did this for so long he blew his engine. This is only a 200cc bike and should be ridden with that in mind. Highway riding and speeds, while attainable, are not suggested.

Now back to the pictures. The right side hose you posed is a vent tube for the carb. Just tuck it up under the seat and you'll be fine.

EDIT: I was posting this while you were so...

Here's Andrews post on installing the exhaust and the brackets he fabed to support it. http://www.chinariders.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=11402&highlight=pro+curcuit

The canister on the right is for the enviro stuff. A lot of the hoses are interconnected with the air pump, the air box, and the gas tank vent. You'll have to decide if you want the air pump (also called a secondary air injection (SAI) device) still on your bike. It will be of no use once you change the pipe. We can walk you through the elimination of it.

[2LZ]

That's a fat jet. I'm running a 125 on my XP and the plug looks good.

If you're going to run that exhaust, put a BB in your air pump vac line and stuff something in the larger rubber hose that connects your air pump to the metal tube that comes out of the head. If you allow that pump to introduce fresh air into your new muffler (without cat), you'll burn up your muffler packing Muy Pronto.

Also, if that exhaust isn't stamped "USFS Approved", don't be caught off-roading. Big ticket.

You're going to LOVE that 44 tooth sprocket.

[david3921]

...you'll burn up your muffler packing...

I did not know this 2LZ. Good catch! I'm glad I disconnected everything when I installed my pipe.

Trixter, 2LZ's comment on the his plug color brings up a point. Checking yours after install will tell you if you are running too rich. Also, was there a slow jet from JP?

[trixter]

Here's Andrews post on installing the exhaust and the brackets he fabed to support it. http://www.chinariders.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=11402&highlight=pro+curcuit


I actually went to lowes already this morning (just got back) and bought some metal to cut and bend a bracket. Fortunately I made a bending brake so I have that going for me. I will need it for the carb mount. I also had to get a slightly longer bolt to replace the one that holds the fuel tank to the frame just under the seat. This will give me something to attach the bracket to. It will be a simple 2 bend bracket with a circle cut out for the carb cap. Horizontal at both the top of the carb and bottom of the fuel tank mount point and a roughly 45 (have yet to measure) slope between the two spots. I will cut it in a sorta trapezoid, the section for the top of the carb needs to be square but after that where I will place a bend it will taper towards the center so that where it gets mounted will be reasonable with 1 bolt without a lot of flap due to vibration.

I had planned on using the same rubber vibration dampener that the original muffler used. I have had my bike not even 2 weeks and have put just over 100 miles on it. The rubber is worn through from the stock muffler and that horrible cardboard like washer has already broken. Really cheap stuff, I also think it got heat damaged during shipment. The throttle tube had to be replaced already, an inner part broke quickly, I think symptomatic of the same stuff, heat+shock during transit.

I think I will leave the can on and just stop it up to disable it. While I never have to get the bike smogged (my county does not do that due to a lack of people) having it means it is easier to deal with.


As for the USFS permit they do not check here, especially with locals (I live right at the edge of the El Dorado National Forest). The state of california is more concerned with spark arrestors than the feds are. The replacement does not say USFS anything but it has a spark arrestor while the stock does not (and has fewer markings). This means that if the bike backfires it is less likely to start a forest fire with the newer pro circuit exhaust. :) As one of the volunteer firemen I think this is a good thing.

[trixter]

I got the easy bracket done, the muffler one. I should be able to ride it to test and make sure its working properly. There was a post that the float valve sometimes sticks and you have to ride it a little and then check the overflow hose. I think that mostly applies to older bikes, mine has just over 100 miles and maybe 2 weeks of being owned so I should not have that problem (no gunk built up yet).

Once I have confirmed the test I will do the carb bracket. I already installed a longer bolt to secure the fuel tank down, on the underside I will attach the top part of the bracket. The bracket will basically be -\_ cept the - is all the way at the top. Kinda a stretched Z. I still want to put some thread locker all over the place on this even though it is probably not required for most of it.

Thanks for the suggestions, I will reread them after my test and see if I missed anything.

[trevort]

That 132.5 main jet sounds like it's going to be way too big, with changing only the main and not the pilot I would stick to the 35/125 or 127.5 and how about moving the needle clip position down too. Also view Andrews post on installing the exhaust, he has the same one and has detailed what brackets he has made and problems he encountered as well. Running the K&N and still being compliant with emissions, I dont think that you can bypass the recirculating air pump that introduces warm crankcase and exhaust gases back into the carburetor. I guess only a real inspection can tell if that bike mod for your state is a hit or miss, and some bracket to support the carbs weight would have to be made in order not to stress the intake manifold or to create any vacuum leaks.

[Weldangrind]

Fortunately I made a bending brake so I have that going for me. I will need it for the carb mount. I also had to get a slightly longer bolt to replace the one that holds the fuel tank to the frame just under the seat. This will give me something to attach the bracket to. It will be a simple 2 bend bracket with a circle cut out for the carb cap. Horizontal at both the top of the carb and bottom of the fuel tank mount point and a roughly 45 (have yet to measure) slope between the two spots. I will cut it in a sorta trapezoid, the section for the top of the carb needs to be square but after that where I will place a bend it will taper towards the center so that where it gets mounted will be reasonable with 1 bolt without a lot of flap due to vibration.

I'm looking forward to the final product. I have a rough idea of what you're doing, but a photo will clear that up. While you're at it, I'd love to see your brake.

[trixter]

The canister on the right is for the enviro stuff. A lot of the hoses are interconnected with the air pump, the air box, and the gas tank vent. You'll have to decide if you want the air pump (also called a secondary air injection (SAI) device) still on your bike. It will be of no use once you change the pipe. We can walk you through the elimination of it.

It runs, its louder :( but it has noticeable pep in acceleration and my top speed per gear appears to be slightly higher :) I only went 1 mile around my house just to test so I only got into 3rd, rpms were kept lower as well since I am only at 100 miles. I was also able to take the hill just before my house with more ease, get up to speed much faster while going up hill, etc. I will connect the gps tomorrow and get the mail, that is a 9+ mile round trip and it will let me see if I can break 45 when not going downhill (my top speed is 53.6 but I was dropping altitude fast from 5000 to 3000 in a few miles). I am trying to do this all one at a time so that I can see what each side of the upgrade is doing, the sprocket will be next after I am satisfied with testing on this.


Got a url for the disabling not removal that is shown to be safe and effective? Will disabling this cure the apparent backfire on decel? I dont know if its real backfire or if its just choking off the air and momentum driving the bike forward, its not constant enough for me to squeeze the clutch lever and see if it goes away. I can try to experiment tomorrow though to see if that is the case.

I have heard that when you get a smaller can its more pronounced and with a closed throttle the engine is being pushed by forward motion of the bike while in gear which ultimately causes this. OTOH it may be there is too much air in the exhaust.


As for a smaller jet, they are $5. I dont know what they have, my conversation went like this:
"I heard you guys have performance kits for xp200s"
"yeah we have sprockets"
"do you have a carb jet and exhaust"
"yeah"
"ok I would like the easier sprocket to change and the kit"

[trixter]

I guess only a real inspection can tell if that bike mod for your state is a hit or miss, and some bracket to support the carbs weight would have to be made in order not to stress the intake manifold or to create any vacuum leaks.

My bike only gets inspected again on title transfer. If that is required the best solution would be a collar between the filter and carb that has an inlet attachment on it. That is what I did for my jeep when I did basically the same thing, mounting a K&N on the throttle body directly like that.

[trixter]

[quote=trixter]
I'm looking forward to the final product. I have a rough idea of what you're doing, but a photo will clear that up. While you're at it, I'd love to see your brake.

For those new to my antics I have one hand, there are other threads that discuss the prosthesis and mods I made to control the bike, the brake is the final mod which is why he is asking about it.


Got the rekluse dual lever assembly, do not have the right banjo bolt and their master cylinder does not have a brake light connector so I got a banjo bolt with a pressure switch ordered. It should arrive at the parts store in town tomorrow, they are going to mail it to me (way cheaper than driving to get it and I wont go into populated areas until I get the front brake working). Mail is usually 1-2 days which means I will get it Saturday or Monday.

I plan on connecting the clutch tomorrow to get used to it. It has to be the shorty lever that is on top (replaces the cover of the master cylinder reservoir). I looked at this thing, its nothing special at all, anyone with a CNC machine can make one of these for any master cylinder reservoir. I may look for a local CNC shop since I dont have a mill and see what they would charge me to make one for a larger master cylinder when I get my next bike (sport bike probably in the 500-650 range).

Rekluse Z-Start Clutch Override

[Weldangrind]

Actually, I was talking about your metal brake, but I'd also like to see the Rekluse stuff.

[LittleBeach]

Quick Question, Is there a "good" crankcase oil to use in these bikes or just off the shelf stuff?

[trixter]

Actually, I was talking about your metal brake, but I'd also like to see the Rekluse stuff.


oh the bending brake? It is nothing special. If you google for diy bending brake you will find tons of articles. For smaller bits of metal you can buy them for $25-50 so it almost does not make sense to build one yourself. In my case I used a piano hinge to provide strength and I bolt a T bar from an older garage door installation down to a metal table saw table.

[FastDoc]

Quick Question, Is there a "good" crankcase oil to use in these bikes or just off the shelf stuff?

Just the Shell stuff is fine. 10W-40 or 20W-50.

[Weldangrind]

Actually, I was talking about your metal brake, but I'd also like to see the Rekluse stuff.


oh the bending brake? It is nothing special. If you google for diy bending brake you will find tons of articles. For smaller bits of metal you can buy them for $25-50 so it almost does not make sense to build one yourself. In my case I used a piano hinge to provide strength and I bolt a T bar from an older garage door installation down to a metal table saw table.

I'd still love to see it. :D I get excellent ideas from homemade projects, and I always appreciate the innovation of others.