Armed Forces Alarmed at the Numbers of Motorcycle Deaths

[elroyjetsn]

Looks like the Marines are focusing on the problem of rising motorcycle deaths in their ranks.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/10/30/mar...ef=mpstoryview

The problem seems to have a connection with the popularity of "sport bikes".

Seems to me that "sport bikes" (we used to call them "Cafe Racers")are designed for track use which means ideal conditions for high speed travel. Just too much power, as well as poor seating posture and low speed handling should make them ineligible for street use.

Besides all that, there's the speed-addiction issue that these bikes are marketed to exploit.

Friends of mine lost a son recently in a sportbike crash. His mom said that he had just recently confided with she and his father how hooked he was on riding fast(he was having problems controlling the urge) and that he wanted to go into motorcycle racing.

I'm old fashioned maybe, but hey. :?

[katoranger]

The need for speed is why I am on a 200cc dual sport bike. The yamaha radian got me into trouble since it would easily do triple digits.

I have noticed the urge riding the big KLR650 also. The bonus to the dual sport is that I am aware of the bikes limits/design and those things keep my speed down and the front tire on the pavement.

That radian was a wheelie machine. Made good money parting it out.


On a side note I will be using the stat on the more marines died on motorcycles than iraq.

Allen

[frostbite]

My employer just wrecked his shoulder (the last remaining good one) on a race modified CRF450. If you've got the juice on tap the temptation to use it is too great.

[Alaskan-Dad]

Having owned a Z-1 900 Kawi I remember how easy that throttle rolled back. :roll:

[IronFist]

Confession time :oops:
I did not think I would like the speed part of riding.

I bought a small displacement vintage motorcycle to stay away from speed. But when the traffic opens up and everyone is doing 80, I admit I really like it. Though I don't go weaving in and out of traffic to go faster. I've thought of racing on a track, but I'm not practicing for that day out on the highway. I don't think I have the risktaker gene; yes I like the feel of 9000 RPM's 8O , but I like it in 2nd and 3rd gear too. It feels like a Spitfire in a powerdive. Carving a corner is cool, but in the back of my mind there is always "what if there is fine sand that I don't see?" and I slow, straighten up and fly right. Even the idea of burning around the track, I think of the 30 other riders and the idea fades from my todo list. Now the idea of a drag bike on a legal drag track, well that is something I still plan to do. I think I'd really enjoy it, and to be honest, I think I'd be very good at it in a short time. When it's done propery, there are still deaths, the chances aren't zero, but crashes are reduced dramaticly.

Maybe someone from the racing crowd should set up something with the US army. If it can be standardized and regulated these guys wouldn't dying nearly as often. Someone has to step in and say where the "stupidline" is, and what happens when it gets crossed.

[winwun]

Is it just possible that the jar-head has to take so much crap, that when he gets the chance to be "his own man" he is going to do what he wants without some spit-blowing gunny demeaning him ?

An in-depth study of the victims should reveal a pattern of behaviour, or discipline "problems" and such that might provide a possible solution to the problem without taking their wheels away.

[lego1970]

Sportbikes are excellent bikes but yes their heritage is based off of the trackbikes. One of the problems with deaths in the military from vehicles accidents is that the majority of the men in the military are still young and take risk without really thinking about the consequences. It takes self disipline and training to know where your limits are, and then it takes well thought out planning to break your old limits if you want to advance. Racers accept the fact that they stand a good chance of dyeing. If you take a 380lb bike with 115, 130 or 160 rear wheel horsepower and don't respect it, you probably won't live very long.

[IronFist]

lego1970 "115, 130 or 160 rear wheel horsepower"

I can't emagine it. Not on my bucket list. Cool for those who do, except they sometimes hit and kill people.

The cb350 with a 50 rear wheel horsepower is the racers dream, it's the myth bike that everyone tries to build. I think it's 36 at the crank and 24 at the rear stock? (stats from memory, don't quote me.) With my motor as it is, I can't be getting more than 20 at the rear wheel, and I'm worried about liking speed? HAHA

Still I do like the acceleration (sp), and safety is about attitude. And my bike will be quite a bit better next year. Yet, on long rides I ride sedate. Next year is my EXIT test for my final licence and that means more motorcycle courses. I joined a vintage motorcycle group to go on sedate rides and to learn to ride like an old rider, not a new rider. Old riders tend to have good habits. I've got 25 years of riding left in me, I'd like to be an old rider :wink:

Still, I hope something can be done about the marines on bikes. I think they are well beyond the entry bike course they have to take. It would cost a lot of money to build them all bike tracks and speedways. So rent local tracks and have inspections and instructors and a clean track. That alone is much safer. Penalize off track racing as hard as Canada. Make it hard to insure racers. Something.

[elroyjetsn]

That's one nice thing about riding 200cc's it's that whenever the urge comes to kick up the front a bit on takeoff or dive into a turn, you remind yourself, "It's jus a wee dirtbike, who cares, who's gonna be impressed?"

Besides everyone's seen a 55mph wheelstand by now and a 120mph flyby on the freeway. You may just draw a yawn for your stupidity! :x

[warrior91]

I am sure that after a season of high gas prices that overall (country/continent/world)population stats on bike crashes will be bumped up as more people ride 2 wheelers ,means more colisions/deaths as well. Law of percentages...or is that averages.


No disrespect to any particular country represented on this forum,word to all involved.
I would be more concerned about reducing friendly fire than riding free!
At least you have a choice...


You can't expect that a guy who flys mach 1 ,resting his finger on triggers, can hardly be blamed for riding 100mph on 900cc's when he is on shore leave.
How about the guys comanding 600hp and sweating with imminent doom, (for himself or the enemy) ...as it could be a roll of the dice...can come home and not pop wheelies ???

Pressure relief, invincibility (didn't get blown up,shotdown,shotup) so how can this little toy hurt?

:? :(

[IronFist]

Valid point Warrior. :wink:

[elroyjetsn]

Originally Posted by warrior91

how can this little toy hurt?(

Ask the families and friends...

Jets are for the sky, racing bikes "sportbikes" are for the racetrack. How many F1's do you see on the road?

[SpeedSouth]

Originally Posted by katoranger

On a side note I will be using the stat on the more marines died on motorcycles than iraq.

Allen

To be fair, that's not really what the article says.

"Motorcycle accidents have killed more Marines in the past 12 months than enemy fire in Iraq, a rate that's so alarming, it has prompted top brass to call a meeting to address the issue, officials say."

They specify enemy fire, which leaves the door open to a great number of other reasons for Marines to die in Iraq. The stat might not even include deaths from IEDs. Is that considered enemy fire? I don't know. Accidents and friendly fire isn't.

Originally Posted by IronFist

I joined a vintage motorcycle group to go on sedate rides and to learn to ride like an old rider, not a new rider. Old riders tend to have good habits. I've got 25 years of riding left in me, I'd like to be an old rider :wink:

Here's some "old" information that I really enjoyed reading, and applies directly to riding in groups and more seasoned riding.

You may have seen it before, it's called The Pace




More on topic, I think it's good the miltary is willing to put more effort into teaching the riders better habits. Maybe they will put less emphasis on that neon vest. It doesn't matter how visible I am if I can't control myself or my machine.

It would be interesting to see more detailed stats on each of the deaths, just to get an idea of the types of crashes we're talking about. Obviously it doesn't matter what kind of bike you're on when a car pulls out in front of you, or runs you over from behind...except that you're more likely to be going slower on bike that doesn't have a massive amount of power.

[tigertamer]

As far back as the eighties, at Moffett Field, Ca., I had to don a helmet and reflective vest to ride on base!

That was when there was no helmet law in CA :twisted:

Back then, most of the traffic fatalities (2 wheelers and 4 wheelers) were due to alcohol consumption in the armed services!

Tigertamer

[AZ200cc]

Seems like they're trying to blame the bikes, Not the riders. It's not the Croth rockets fault that the rider went beyond what they could control.
Not many people normally die doing something in a smart and safe way...And I have never known anyone who died because they put a helmet on.....