Oil level on Dipstick

[ddilink]

I have a Magician 250cc. I have had problems with shifting. I changed the oil to synthetic and followed the owner's manual instructions 1.6 quarts. When I checked the oil on the dipstick it was about 1/2' above the full line. Do I have the wrong dipstick or what. Shifting problem is cured. I have been maintaining the level at full and now think which may be too low which cause the shifting problem. Any help is much appreciated.

[JerryHawk250]

It should only take a quart. The 1.6 if for a completely dry engine. Not all the oil will drain out when changing the oil. You are over filled.

[ddilink]

Thank you. But I have to disagree. I drained the oil from a hot engine, I pulled the spark plug wire and turned it over a few times. I'm pretty sure I go most of the oil out, plus .6 of a quart is a lot pf oil to be left in the engine.

[ddilink]

You don't have to be nasty about it. It was a legitimate question as it seemed .6 of a quart was too much to hide in the engine. I'll turn the bike upside down next time.

[Magician16]

The correct way to tell how much oil to use is to look at the sight glass when the bike is straight up and down. If it's leaning on the side stand, it is not visible on my Magician. The dipstick in my opinion is only good as an oil filler cap.


When I bought my Bashan Storm, the previous owner was filling the bike 'til it showed full on the dipstick. It wouldn't start or shift right until I changed the oil and put the correct amount of synthetic oil in.

[Myinfo]

I have a hawk 250. Most of the hawk 250 moto bloggers online have a problem with getting oil all over their air filter. This is my first motorcycle, but not my first experience wrenching. They- being the online authority on the hawk 250- use the sight glass to gauge the oil level. I use the dip stick- which op believes is wrong as my comprehension leads me to believe- and I don't have any oil on my air filter. I just finished an oil change at 6000 miles, the air filter is still w h I t e. I have changed my oil 8 times from brand new till now. I use the dip stick, and 3/4 of a quart of whatever is cheapest and wet clutch rated.

TLDR: drain the oil, pull the dip stick, add oil, stand the bike upright for a minute, put the dipstick in the engine without threading it in, and check the level until it's full.

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by ddilink

You don't have to be nasty about it. It was a legitimate question as it seemed .6 of a quart was too much to hide in the engine. I'll turn the bike upside down next time.

His answer wasn't nasty. It was just factual. You responded rudely simply because you don't want to believe what was said after coming here asking for information.

Fun fact for you. If you tore this engine apart and cleaned it out completely and filled it with about 1.5 quarts of oil, ran it for a while, let it sit for a while and then checked the oil level it would show about 3/4 of the way up the sight glass with the bike level. When you drained the oil, you would get a bit more than a quart out (about 1.1-1.2).

The rest of that oil that you claim couldn't be trapped in the engine? It's stuck in the main and counter shafts of the transmission, which are hollow to allow oil passage to the bearings and slides. The oil passages in the case halves, the oil spinner, the oil pump, and what isn't trapped in all of those various places is just stuck to the clutch pack, engine cases, cylinder head, trapped in the case halves, etc. You would be surprised how well a third of a quart of oil can hide.

The reason most people here recommend just 1 quart during an oil change is because that tends to put the oil level halfway up the sight glass, which is acceptable to run and also prevents excessive oil migrating it ways through the breather and into the air box, which is a common problem when the oil is filled beyond the halfway point.

So, would you like to continue to be a know-it-all? I can be way meaner than he was. Others here have seen it.

[Teklock]

Originally Posted by Megadan

His answer wasn't nasty. It was just factual. You responded rudely simply because you don't want to believe what was said after coming here asking for information.

Fun fact for you. If you tore this engine apart and cleaned it out completely and filled it with about 1.5 quarts of oil, ran it for a while, let it sit for a while and then checked the oil level it would show about 3/4 of the way up the sight glass with the bike level. When you drained the oil, you would get a bit more than a quart out (about 1.1-1.2).

The rest of that oil that you claim couldn't be trapped in the engine? It's stuck in the main and counter shafts of the transmission, which are hollow to allow oil passage to the bearings and slides. The oil passages in the case halves, the oil spinner, the oil pump, and what isn't trapped in all of those various places is just stuck to the clutch pack, engine cases, cylinder head, trapped in the case halves, etc. You would be surprised how well a third of a quart of oil can hide.

The reason most people here recommend just 1 quart during an oil change is because that tends to put the oil level halfway up the sight glass, which is acceptable to run and also prevents excessive oil migrating it ways through the breather and into the air box, which is a common problem when the oil is filled beyond the halfway point.

So, would you like to continue to be a know-it-all? I can be way meaner than he was. Others here have seen it.

To be fair, you don't seem to be in agreement with .6qts staying in the engine either.

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by Teklock

To be fair, you don't seem to be in agreement with .6qts staying in the engine either.

Yeah, did you read the rest of it? I said if you put in about 1.5 quarts from freshly assembled, ran it, let it sit and then drain it, you would see about 3/4 of the way up the sight glass for full - which is the actual true Full level, and about 1.1-1.2 quarts would come out. With simple math one can deduce that about .3 quarts is left behind.

I then stated that most put in only 1 quart to get the level to halfway up the sight glass to avoid other issues. That means you aren't putting in the full volume to begin with, so even less is going in, so you get less out. If you figure it takes that .1 to .2 extra quarts to get it to 3/4 of the way up so that it is full, and then add it to the .3 quarts left behind you get.... .5 quarts. *shocked face*

Critical thinking is a skill...

[JerryHawk250]

No point in arguing over this. Point is the engine will take less than 1.6 quarts. Every engine is different and will fluctuate. There's a site glass on the side of the engine for a reason. Use it. With the bike sitting straight and not on kick stand, the oil level should be between the middle to top of the site glass.

[ddilink]

This question sure raised a lot of responses. So what I did was to drain the new oil until it showed about 7/8 in the sight glass. I then poured the oil into a measuring cup which read 20 ounces or .6 quarts. It still shows over on the dipstick. I guess in the future I only need 1 quart when changing the oil. I still find it hard to believe that .6 quart does not drain from the engine given the manual says the capacity is 1.6 quarts.

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by ddilink

This question sure raised a lot of responses. So what I did was to drain the new oil until it showed about 7/8 in the sight glass. I then poured the oil into a measuring cup which read 20 ounces or .6 quarts. It still shows over on the dipstick. I guess in the future I only need 1 quart when changing the oil. I still find it hard to believe that .6 quart does not drain from the engine given the manual says the capacity is 1.6 quarts.

It probably doesn't take exactly 1.6 quarts. You have to remember the manuals for these machines were poorly translated to English and a lot of the figures aren't exactly precise anyway. The point I was trying to make was, they can, and do, take more than 1 quart when the engine has never had oil in it before. After that, it takes a tiny bit more than a quart to do a basic oil change, and most people just use 1 quart because it works fine and makes it far easier.

You also need to remember, your engine already had oil in it before you ever got it. It didn't get shipped dry.

Heck, the traditional Honda method for an oil level check is to check the level 5 minutes after shutting it off from running. They still recommend that even to this day, and is the factory method for proper oil level checks on even my VFR.

[Huck369]

Just throwing this out, just because some do not know, but you are checking the oil with-OUT screwing in the dipstick, correct?
I've seen many people try to read it by screwing it in, but is supposed to be just inserted until the threads touch, with the bike sitting straight up, to get a good reading.....just a thought...

[Thumper]

Wow. So many different views on this

All of the Suzuki roadbikes I have owned only had a sight glass. The procedure was simple. Pull it up on the centerstand, fill it with about the number of ccs written on the top of the crankcase, and see that it levels out with sight glass at about 75-80% covered (air clearly visible as ~20% in the sight glass). Some have hi/lo marks with a 200-400cc range on larger engines.

NO oil was visible in the sight glass when sitting on the side stand since the sight glass is on the other side of the engine!

Therefore, any sight glass in a motorcycle engine should be read with the engine level. I do this by hand usually, pulling the bike over with my arm up to the handlebar until it is balanced while I watch the sight glass. I rock it back and forth over the balanced position while observing the sight glass and top off accordingly. I think this gives me a better assessment than just putting the bike on a lift. You can see the oil rise and fall while you rock it, and balance point is easy to find.

If you have a dipstick too, then put it kick stand down (level ground), and check it with the dipstick. If these two readings concur within reason, should be fine.

Keep in mind that there is a range of oil capacity that will support these little engines between 1 and 1.4 quarts, depending on which engine. Too much can blow seals, not enough and there won't be sufficient lube. So there is some leeway. Also, more oil distributes heat a little better and lasts a bit longer before oil change. I change the oil so often I don't worry about oil quality

Most small engines indicate do NOT screw in the dipstick (like Huck sez). Not all of them, but most. I suggest the sight glass check first, then see what the dipstick indicates, either not screwed in, or screwed in. See what the difference is. The dip stick goes in at an angle, and if not at that angle, it could easily go deeper into the sump.