Vader Experience Boom - Page 3

wlfpck · 08-13-2018, 04:44 PM

cbrfxr67, what did you register your motorcycle under for make/model?

Like for the Icebear Fuerza it's Daix PMZ125-1.

For the Vader... it should be something like Baidao 125 or something like that.

cbrfxr67 · 08-13-2018, 05:57 PM

Mine's a Jiangsu Baodiao BD125-15,.... great little bike, well except crappy front suspension but can fix that eventually :P
------------------------
and it's time to do the forks. Rode home last night, bonk bonk, bonk bonk, bonk,... I cant take it anymore. Going to try the and will update with results

cbrfxr67 · 08-20-2018, 11:36 AM

I don't always use my engine hoist but when I do, I use it to lift chinese minibikes! haha

So the honda fork mod does not work on the vader. The internals are not the same. Maybe someone can figure out a way to make it work but the way they did it is a cheapo version. I used some 20 weight at 250ml after pumping out all the old metallic slimy whatever oil that was. Much better than the previous bonk bonk bonk suspension I had.

I don't know how my front axle got bent but replaced with with a grom japanese upgrade.

Took it out to go to the gym and snapped a picture challenge pic for another forum. Why don't we have a picture game challenge here,...

RedCrowRides · 08-20-2018, 12:05 PM

That goo they put in the front end shouldn't even be called " Fork Oil", I don't know what exactly it is but it is horrible and has the damping quality of gnat piss. Just switching over to real fork oil should have helped a great deal, the valving really isn't bad on a Vader ,the problem is that goo is so bad it doesn't allow the valving to work as it should.

Anyways I have some Front Fork Preload Adjusters I ordered that according to your photos should work ,by taking the stock fork cap off ,the preload adjuster bolt sits on top of that shaft and then when you install the adjustable caps, running the adjuster bolt down sets the preload by pressing that shaft down ,so it should work which is a relief since they were kinda pricey heh. I really need to stop making excuses and post a photo of my Vader, i'll try my best to get it done today.

wlfpck · 08-20-2018, 03:49 PM

Looks like the fork mod should be even easier/cheaper on the clones.

By the looks of it, that rod screws into the factory cap. Adding a couple washers should still give it enough room to be screwed into the cap but would effectively add some height.

cbrfxr67 · 08-20-2018, 03:57 PM

wlfpck i did consider it but didn't think it would add enough to make a difference. Been looking at grom forks to swap, maybe; I'm not in a hurry. Feels way better with the 20# oil so I'm ok for now.

wlfpck · 08-20-2018, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbrfxr67

wlfpck i did consider it but didn't think it would add enough to make a difference. Been looking at grom forks to swap, maybe; I'm not in a hurry. Feels way better with the 20# oil so I'm ok for now.

Did you pull the whole thing out? Curious as to see if it is like the Grom where everything has to come out to change the spring, including getting the bottom of off (where the wheel and brakes mount). Watching the video for the Grom on putting in the full upgraded suspension involved heating with a torch and a special clamp tool. :|

cbrfxr67 · 08-24-2018, 09:59 AM

Been hearing some jingling lately and found this last night while adjusting my clutch cable. Was a real pita to get out. The grom bolt did not fit. Seems like the frame bolt hole is too small. There are two other slots where nothing is bolted up that fit the grom bolts perfect. I dunno.

The bolt they used is definitely too small. Looking for a replacement bolt. Was a little pissed but it isn't like this issue hasn't been posted over and over

RedCrowRides · 08-24-2018, 12:50 PM

Yeah, for those engine mount bolts to fail as often as they do, seems like the Dealers would have notified the Factory that they got to do something about it .Also, I knew about it but one of the stock bolts absolutely does not want to come out ,found that out when I tried to change it out before it became a problem, since as you mentioned this is a known issue, but I'm afraid its going to strip out or wring off it is so over tightened now .,I am thinking thats whats making them fail is they are stretching the bolt by overtightening it that hard, on top of it being too short and of poor quality. So far I've been hosing it down with WD40 for 3 consecutive days ,in a couple more days I guess I'll try and use my electric impact and hope for the best .

Bruces · 08-24-2018, 01:57 PM

A lot of the Chinese bolts are made in the exact same factory and to the exact same recipe as “I can’t believe it’s not butter “ .

Chinabike · 08-24-2018, 06:11 PM

Bolt, Flange (8mmX140)
and
Bolt, Flange (8mmX110)

Hellkitty · 08-24-2018, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedCrowRides

Yeah, for those engine mount bolts to fail as often as they do, seems like the Dealers would have notified the Factory that they got to do something about it .Also, I knew about it but one of the stock bolts absolutely does not want to come out ,found that out when I tried to change it out before it became a problem, since as you mentioned this is a known issue, but I'm afraid its going to strip out or wring off it is so over tightened now .,I am thinking thats whats making them fail is they are stretching the bolt by overtightening it that hard, on top of it being too short and of poor quality. So far I've been hosing it down with WD40 for 3 consecutive days ,in a couple more days I guess I'll try and use my electric impact and hope for the best .

When I bought my Hellcat last Dec. there were two replacement engine bolts in a pouch taped to the outside of the crate with no instructions, it just said "parts". Initially I had no idea what they were for, but I later figured out they had to be engine bolts cause there was nothing else they could be for. Two grade 8 bolts with zinc or cad plating and nylock nuts. I still dont know if the dealer or the manufacturer put them there. Since they were SAE grade 8 it leaves me to believe the dealer put them there. Anyway,someone knew there was an issue with the stock bolts.

RedCrowRides · 08-25-2018, 07:21 AM

Well that's good news Hellkitty, at least some Dealers are reacting .Sadly I did not receive that same Care Package from who I purchased my bike from . It's a shame the issue is so widely known and experienced to the point that it is now "common knowledge" that you just need to plan on replacing them as part of your purchase ,and apparently the powers that be feel that they are okay with that . It just doesn't make any sense to me, even in the "It's a China bike" context. Upgrading two key bolts to acceptable ones just isnt a lot of money to a Manufacturer who would buy in bulk and the known issues have been reduced to so few that to address them and put out a trouble free Bike just isn't that far away cost wise and I'm sure everyone would gladly pay an addtl $25 or so on the front end to have them dealt with by the Factory and be done with it ,why they have seemingly made the decision to keep cranking out bikes with engine mount bolts that WILL fail is just baffling to me , but what ever lol.

wlfpck · 08-27-2018, 11:07 AM

Use Zinc Coated (for corrosion protection) Class 10.9 or better yet Class 12.9 bolts.

Class 10.9 is the grade 8 equivalent. Class 12.9 is even stronger.

Fastenal carries them. Should be less than $5 a bolt.

cbrfxr67 · 08-27-2018, 11:29 AM

Finally got some time to work on this. Sorry I didn't take as many pics as I shouldve. The grom bolts were bigger than the crappy little one Jiangsu used. So, I drilled out the hole to accept the bigger bolt. Yes it was a pita.
I can see why they use the smaller bolt though. The weld from the swingarm bushing area doesn't give much space for wide (shoulder) bolt or nut. In fact you can't even get the bolt/nut in there with the swingarm on.

I used my jack to slightly get it out of the way enough to get my nut on. I used a hobby knife to trim the chain rubber a bit, just to make sure it didn't bind.

Again sorry I didn't take more pics. Here's my nice big bolt installed after alot of smack talking,...

Much more 'solid' feel to the bike. Buzzier in the foot pegs as well. What's next,....

08-13-2018, 04:44 PM	#31
wlfpck Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 249	cbrfxr67, what did you register your motorcycle under for make/model? Like for the Icebear Fuerza it's Daix PMZ125-1. For the Vader... it should be something like Baidao 125 or something like that. __________________ 2020 Honda Grom 2017 Icebear Fuerza (Daix PMZ125-1) - Sold
	0

08-13-2018, 05:57 PM	#32
cbrfxr67 Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: HOuston Posts: 357	Mine's a Jiangsu Baodiao BD125-15,.... great little bike, well except crappy front suspension but can fix that eventually :P ------------------------ and it's time to do the forks. Rode home last night, bonk bonk, bonk bonk, bonk,... I cant take it anymore. Going to try the and will update with results __________________ BD125-15 Last edited by cbrfxr67; 08-14-2018 at 01:15 PM.
	0

08-20-2018, 11:36 AM	#33
cbrfxr67 Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: HOuston Posts: 357	I don't always use my engine hoist but when I do, I use it to lift chinese minibikes! haha So the honda fork mod does not work on the vader. The internals are not the same. Maybe someone can figure out a way to make it work but the way they did it is a cheapo version. I used some 20 weight at 250ml after pumping out all the old metallic slimy whatever oil that was. Much better than the previous bonk bonk bonk suspension I had. I don't know how my front axle got bent but replaced with with a grom japanese upgrade. Took it out to go to the gym and snapped a picture challenge pic for another forum. Why don't we have a picture game challenge here,... __________________ BD125-15
	3

08-20-2018, 12:05 PM	#34
RedCrowRides Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Florida Posts: 759	That goo they put in the front end shouldn't even be called " Fork Oil", I don't know what exactly it is but it is horrible and has the damping quality of gnat piss. Just switching over to real fork oil should have helped a great deal, the valving really isn't bad on a Vader ,the problem is that goo is so bad it doesn't allow the valving to work as it should. Anyways I have some Front Fork Preload Adjusters I ordered that according to your photos should work ,by taking the stock fork cap off ,the preload adjuster bolt sits on top of that shaft and then when you install the adjustable caps, running the adjuster bolt down sets the preload by pressing that shaft down ,so it should work which is a relief since they were kinda pricey heh. I really need to stop making excuses and post a photo of my Vader, i'll try my best to get it done today. __________________ 2001 Mustang GT 2004 Sportster 2018 VADER 2020 Orion RXB250L
	2

08-20-2018, 03:49 PM	#35
wlfpck Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 249	Looks like the fork mod should be even easier/cheaper on the clones. By the looks of it, that rod screws into the factory cap. Adding a couple washers should still give it enough room to be screwed into the cap but would effectively add some height. __________________ 2020 Honda Grom 2017 Icebear Fuerza (Daix PMZ125-1) - Sold
	1

08-20-2018, 03:57 PM	#36
cbrfxr67 Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: HOuston Posts: 357	wlfpck i did consider it but didn't think it would add enough to make a difference. Been looking at grom forks to swap, maybe; I'm not in a hurry. Feels way better with the 20# oil so I'm ok for now. __________________ BD125-15
	0

08-24-2018, 09:59 AM	#38
cbrfxr67 Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: HOuston Posts: 357	Been hearing some jingling lately and found this last night while adjusting my clutch cable. Was a real pita to get out. The grom bolt did not fit. Seems like the frame bolt hole is too small. There are two other slots where nothing is bolted up that fit the grom bolts perfect. I dunno. The bolt they used is definitely too small. Looking for a replacement bolt. Was a little pissed but it isn't like this issue hasn't been posted over and over __________________ BD125-15 Last edited by cbrfxr67; 08-24-2018 at 12:20 PM.
	0

08-24-2018, 12:50 PM	#39
RedCrowRides Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Florida Posts: 759	Yeah, for those engine mount bolts to fail as often as they do, seems like the Dealers would have notified the Factory that they got to do something about it .Also, I knew about it but one of the stock bolts absolutely does not want to come out ,found that out when I tried to change it out before it became a problem, since as you mentioned this is a known issue, but I'm afraid its going to strip out or wring off it is so over tightened now .,I am thinking thats whats making them fail is they are stretching the bolt by overtightening it that hard, on top of it being too short and of poor quality. So far I've been hosing it down with WD40 for 3 consecutive days ,in a couple more days I guess I'll try and use my electric impact and hope for the best . __________________ 2001 Mustang GT 2004 Sportster 2018 VADER 2020 Orion RXB250L
	1

08-24-2018, 01:57 PM	#40
Bruces Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 1,649	A lot of the Chinese bolts are made in the exact same factory and to the exact same recipe as “I can’t believe it’s not butter “ .
	2

08-24-2018, 06:11 PM	#41
Chinabike Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 361	Bolt, Flange (8mmX140) and Bolt, Flange (8mmX110)
	1

08-25-2018, 07:21 AM	#43
RedCrowRides Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Florida Posts: 759	Well that's good news Hellkitty, at least some Dealers are reacting .Sadly I did not receive that same Care Package from who I purchased my bike from . It's a shame the issue is so widely known and experienced to the point that it is now "common knowledge" that you just need to plan on replacing them as part of your purchase ,and apparently the powers that be feel that they are okay with that . It just doesn't make any sense to me, even in the "It's a China bike" context. Upgrading two key bolts to acceptable ones just isnt a lot of money to a Manufacturer who would buy in bulk and the known issues have been reduced to so few that to address them and put out a trouble free Bike just isn't that far away cost wise and I'm sure everyone would gladly pay an addtl $25 or so on the front end to have them dealt with by the Factory and be done with it ,why they have seemingly made the decision to keep cranking out bikes with engine mount bolts that WILL fail is just baffling to me , but what ever lol. __________________ 2001 Mustang GT 2004 Sportster 2018 VADER 2020 Orion RXB250L
	1

08-27-2018, 11:07 AM	#44
wlfpck Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 249	Use Zinc Coated (for corrosion protection) Class 10.9 or better yet Class 12.9 bolts. Class 10.9 is the grade 8 equivalent. Class 12.9 is even stronger. Fastenal carries them. Should be less than $5 a bolt. __________________ 2020 Honda Grom 2017 Icebear Fuerza (Daix PMZ125-1) - Sold
	1

08-27-2018, 11:29 AM	#45
cbrfxr67 Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: HOuston Posts: 357	Finally got some time to work on this. Sorry I didn't take as many pics as I shouldve. The grom bolts were bigger than the crappy little one Jiangsu used. So, I drilled out the hole to accept the bigger bolt. Yes it was a pita. I can see why they use the smaller bolt though. The weld from the swingarm bushing area doesn't give much space for wide (shoulder) bolt or nut. In fact you can't even get the bolt/nut in there with the swingarm on. I used my jack to slightly get it out of the way enough to get my nut on. I used a hobby knife to trim the chain rubber a bit, just to make sure it didn't bind. Again sorry I didn't take more pics. Here's my nice big bolt installed after alot of smack talking,... Much more 'solid' feel to the bike. Buzzier in the foot pegs as well. What's next,.... __________________ BD125-15
	3