Hawk 250 supermoto

[Alaskaalaska]

Rear wheel vid:

[Megadan]

Awesome job updating this with the videos. I had to laugh about the swing arm comment. "They just sort of come together" lol.

I do want to toss this out there as a potential option if you are willing to order from China and wait up to a month to get them. There are a couple of more popular bikes that use the same front and rear hub design as the Hawk, right down to the brake rotor and speedo drive of the front hub, and sprocket and rear rotor of the back hub. One such bike is called the CQR250, and there are Sumo wheels available for them through TaoBao (and probably Yoycart, etc).

Here are a couple of examples.
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=...7207:593705943

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=...7207:158258612

They come with the tires, and are about $95-$105 for both rims with the tires. If you purchase through engtaobao, the shipping to the U.S. will likely be in the $150-200 range (maybe even a bit more). mainly due to the weight. I am searching for just the wheels to cut the weight down and lower the shipping a little bit, but I have strongly considered ordering a set for my own Hawk for around town use so I can throw a set of more aggressive tires on it when I desire more dirt in my life.

Just figured I would share. I am trying to decide if I want to order these first, or a set of the same hub and spoke style but with 21 and 18 inch wheels for my current tires (about $70).

[NzBrakelathes]

Originally Posted by Megadan

Awesome job updating this with the videos. I had to laugh about the swing arm comment. "They just sort of come together" lol.

I do want to toss this out there as a potential option if you are willing to order from China and wait up to a month to get them. There are a couple of more popular bikes that use the same front and rear hub design as the Hawk, right down to the brake rotor and speedo drive of the front hub, and sprocket and rear rotor of the back hub. One such bike is called the CQR250, and there are Sumo wheels available for them through TaoBao (and probably Yoycart, etc).

Here are a couple of examples.
https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=...7207:593705943

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=...7207:158258612

They come with the tires, and are about $95-$105 for both rims with the tires. If you purchase through engtaobao, the shipping to the U.S. will likely be in the $150-200 range (maybe even a bit more). mainly due to the weight. I am searching for just the wheels to cut the weight down and lower the shipping a little bit, but I have strongly considered ordering a set for my own Hawk for around town use so I can throw a set of more aggressive tires on it when I desire more dirt in my life.

Just figured I would share. I am trying to decide if I want to order these first, or a set of the same hub and spoke style but with 21 and 18 inch wheels for my current tires (about $70).

Those wheels don’t fit the Hawk ( I own a CQR A3/5 model the cheapest type with usd forks)
I’m not sure which do as it’s not common in china
I thought about having wheels built but costs get out of hand and logistically a nightmare as I’ve done similar for the RX3
Costs get to $200 a wheel total no tyre if using decent parts n shipping tk the USA (that’s leaving me a smallish margin but a fair headache)

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by NzBrakelathes

Those wheels don’t fit the Hawk ( I own a CQR A3/5 model the cheapest type with usd forks)
I’m not sure which do as it’s not common in china
I thought about having wheels built but costs get out of hand and logistically a nightmare as I’ve done similar for the RX3
Costs get to $200 a wheel total no tyre if using decent parts n shipping tk the USA (that’s leaving me a smallish margin but a fair headache)

Why don't they fit? Same speedo drive on the hub and same brake bolt pattern and offset as far as I can tell. Rear hub is identical. Same wheel bearings. If anything, possibly the bearing spacing is different, but that can be resolved with new spacers if needed.

I can order just the hubs if necessary and test fit them. Would be way cheaper than buying a whole wheel. https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm...ucket=2#detail

about 25 bucks plus whatever shipping would cost. Would be a much cheaper way to verify fitment than dropping 250-300 bucks on a whole wheel set.

[Alaskaalaska]

Some additional useful info for custom spacers:
Front axle-
Hawk 12mm
Ninja 15mm
Rear axle-
Hawk 15mm
Ninja 17mm

Rear wheel:
Brake bracket spacer oem hawk 25mm od
Ninja spacer 28mm od 15mm width

Ninja sprocket side 35mm od spacer 16mm wide
Hawk 28mm od 26.3 width

Ninja wheel bearing info:
Front

two #6202 - 15mm ID / 35mm OD
Rear

one #6203 - 17mm ID / 40mm OD
one #6303 - 17mm ID / 47mm OD
Sprocket carrier: one #6205 - 25mm ID / 52mm OD

Sleeves maybe? Rear could be fitted but the forks don't have much meat to size out. I just ordered all the parts needed to convert my stock wheels to 520 and a ninja sprocket to 39t (so I can swap and use the same chain.)
I'm already 200$ deep and haven't done any permanent modifications except cutting that speedo holding nub off.

NZBrakeLathes, any idea as to why they won't fit? There is a hawk 250 model available in the us that has 'street wheels/tires" but I'd have to Google it to see what it is. Those wheels look much closer to stock than the ninja wheels, though.

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by Alaskaalaska

Some additional useful info for custom spacers:
Front axle-
Hawk 12mm
Ninja 15mm
Rear axle-
Hawk 15mm
Ninja 17mm

Sleeves maybe? Rear could be fitted but the forks don't have much meat to size out. I just ordered all the parts needed to convert my stock wheels to 520 and a ninja sprocket to 39t (so I can swap and use the same chain.)
I'm already 200$ deep and haven't done any permanent modifications except cutting that speedo holding nub off.

Sleeves aren't entirely a bad idea. You can buy tubing in the ID and OD needed to sleeve over the axle and sit inside the bearing inner races. The trick will be getting the length just right to function properly. The tubes will need to be the same length as the distance between the outer edges of the inner races on each side of the hub.

This would work for the front. http://metric-steel.spahrmetric.com/...08-15-01-512-0

For the rear. http://metric-steel.spahrmetric.com/...08-17-01-015-0

This would allow you to use the Hawk axles on both wheels.

[Alaskaalaska]

Yoycart comes to about 600$ with shipping, I'd bet engtaobao isn't far off. What a shame, they only ask 50-80 for the set...100$ on yoycart. They look like an exact fit, too.

[NzBrakelathes]

My CQR is a 15mm front axle
Solid rear sprocket mount too.

The Hawk Hubs are not the same as CQR even the basic version like mine (unless conventional shock version differs but those shocks are bigger I thought at well) but I’m not clear on what the hawk actually is
So many variables

[NzBrakelathes]

If I had samples of hubs it’s possible to make wheels etc
Hub plus spoke option plus rim option to quality or cheap etc
CQR parts are maybe just a little better then hawk but there’s better than that as well.

I’ve looked and searched Taobao as I’m local but not really seen a confirmed fit
Hawk is very much an odd ball bike and not sold in china
Just a few were sold randomly but not the same
I have a couple stripped bike and one has usd forks but no wheel or swing arm
So even for me I can’t test fit etc

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by NzBrakelathes

My CQR is a 15mm front axle
Solid rear sprocket mount too.

The Hawk Hubs are not the same as CQR even the basic version like mine (unless conventional shock version differs but those shocks are bigger I thought at well) but I’m not clear on what the hawk actually is
So many variables

The hub design is the same, but I didn't realize they use the larger bearings like the Ninja wheels (6202).

I think the older "traditional" fork CQR wheels used the same bearings as the Hawk though. I know I saw a set of hubs with the right bearing inner diameters for a CQR, so there has to be something out there. The TT250 uses a similar rear hub as the CQR and the same axle diameter as the Hawk out back, so it exists to some degree. The hard part is finding what I found before.

[humanbeing]

Originally Posted by NzBrakelathes

...
So many variables

Compares 翼俠/白菜 轮毂(hub) in taobao will learn something new. CQR (ie. forget it) the spokes are in different shape.

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by humanbeing

Compares 翼俠/白菜 轮毂(hub) in taobao will learn something new. CQR (ie. forget it) the spokes are in different shape.

Which is why I want to swap the whole wheel assembly. I could run a sleeve just like we discussed the Ninja wheels, but the freight with tires makes it silly expensive anyway thanks to the weight. Without tires and tubes it would be quite a bit cheaper, but still expensive enough that you could probably buy the rims and get spokes to lace it to your existing hubs and have wheels that fit. I discussed just getting the hubs to test fitment with the forks/swing arm, and not to use with the Hawk wheels. As for the 21/18 wheels I also want, I am just going to order some rims from Aliexpress and lace them to my current wheels.

[NzBrakelathes]

I sent the Rx3 to north china to a real wheel guy with a real machine and real technique and real torquing of spokes
He used a very high quality rim and spiked to match to the hub n had the slightly grind off a mm or so if somebody pokes to get a very good wheel that plays like a harp. $120 my total cost.

The cheaper wheel I had made up in Chongqing with a fair quality X2 rim and he’s wheel you could hear each spoke wasn’t tensioned equally my cost $85

Factor in your USA wage to my income n you work a day or 2 for a wheel in the USA
I work much longer to get a wheel not as good and it has a cheaper $ cost

Taobao is common to “look right” but not “be right”
That’s first hand experience plenty of times

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by NzBrakelathes

I sent the Rx3 to north china to a real wheel guy with a real machine and real technique and real torquing of spokes
He used a very high quality rim and spiked to match to the hub n had the slightly grind off a mm or so if somebody pokes to get a very good wheel that plays like a harp. $120 my total cost.

The cheaper wheel I had made up in Chongqing with a fair quality X2 rim and he’s wheel you could hear each spoke wasn’t tensioned equally my cost $85

Factor in your USA wage to my income n you work a day or 2 for a wheel in the USA
I work much longer to get a wheel not as good and it has a cheaper $ cost

Taobao is common to “look right” but not “be right”
That’s first hand experience plenty of times

It would be 4 hours of work for me for the really good wheel, but here in the U.S. a really good wheel would be a couple days of work, up to a weeks wages for somebody making minimum wage. For that kind of money you would also get a precisely made and quality checked hoop with distortion checked to the micron level, Spokes and spoke nuts that would be made by unobtanium compared to the quality of the Hawks stuff, and a very high quality CNC billet hub.

I could send my Hawk's hubs off to a company like Buchanan's, and for about $350 plus labor per wheel, get back something amazing with stainless spokes and spoke nuts in a larger gauge with a damn good rim. Then, once I have spent nearly 2/3 the value of the bike I would have two great wheels.

Or for about $150-180, I can get AHL or Tusk alloy rims. and lace them up to my Hawk with the original spokes, and be better off then where I started. For another $120 to $200 I could upgrade the spokes and spoke nuts if I so desired.

With enough bargain hunting one could pick up some good used alloy rims even cheaper.

[NzBrakelathes]

Originally Posted by Megadan

It would be 4 hours of work for me for the really good wheel, but here in the U.S. a really good wheel would be a couple days of work, up to a weeks wages for somebody making minimum wage. For that kind of money you would also get a precisely made and quality checked hoop with distortion checked to the micron level, Spokes and spoke nuts that would be made by unobtanium compared to the quality of the Hawks stuff, and a very high quality CNC billet hub.

I could send my Hawk's hubs off to a company like Buchanan's, and for about $350 plus labor per wheel, get back something amazing with stainless spokes and spoke nuts in a larger gauge with a damn good rim. Then, once I have spent nearly 2/3 the value of the bike I would have two great wheels.

Or for about $150-180, I can get AHL or Tusk alloy rims. and lace them up to my Hawk with the original spokes, and be better off then where I started. For another $120 to $200 I could upgrade the spokes and spoke nuts if I so desired.

With enough bargain hunting one could pick up some good used alloy rims even cheaper.

That is the thing - what it costs me to get it to you/customer and other USA side options etc.

If economical I would look harder - if not then no use for either party etc.