Why are there no threads about new bikes?

[Megadan]

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

CF Moto does have 300-450cc bike for a reasonable price. https://cfmotousa.com/motorcycles

Yeah, and I am sure it's a decent bike too. Component wise the quality may be on par with the Japanese stuff in the same bracket.

It's still down on power at 29hp, 7 less than the RZ3S, and more expensive.

Then there is the Elephant in the room nobody wants to talk about. Resale - both value and ease of doing so.

Used 300 to 400cc class bikes are hot on the second hand market, so they sell for just a few hundred less than new. The CF Moto and the RZ3S wouldn't hold that kind of value, and won't attract the same number of buyers.

A great example of this is the Genuine G400C. Arguably not a bad bike, but it is a slow seller. A dealer in Kansas City still has 3 2020's in stock, brand new. They won't sell because they won't come down on the price at all. Put them at 3k and I bet they would all sell in short order.

[AJ22_ChinaRider]

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

New bikes coming to the US in April of this year. Moto Morini X-Cape 650 and Seiemmezzo .
The engine is based off the Kawasaki 650 twin. The engine is built by CF Moto. It Looks like the Lifan KPT400 will be delayed till later this year or beginning of next year because of EPA issues. I'm personally liking the X-Cape over the KPT400 now. https://www.motomoriniusa.com/motorcycles

The X-Cape looks mean but the promo video shows them just going on a flat paved road . Only the brochure has a few pics of it offroad!

[JerryHawk250]

Originally Posted by AJ22_ChinaRider

The X-Cape looks mean but the promo video shows them just going on a flat paved road . Only the brochure has a few pics of it offroad!

I've watched a few off road videos. Pretty impressive.

[Megadan]

Speaking of CF Moto, I came across this today. A 200ish hp 1000cc V4 sport bike. Sounds like they are trying to make a serious competitor for the liter bike market.

https://www.cycleworld.com/motorcycl...sportbike-v-4/

This really has my interest, as I am a big V4 guy.

[BobL]

I glanced at the CF Moto 300SS, but at $4500 for a 300 single, I'd rather go the little bit extra and get the 400 twin Ninja. Either one is more than I wanna spend though. I'm really just looking for something to toy around town on. I'm well past the age of needin a bike that can do 0 to 60 in half a second.

[JerryHawk250]

Originally Posted by BobL

I glanced at the CF Moto 300SS, but at $4500 for a 300 single, I'd rather go the little bit extra and get the 400 twin Ninja. Either one is more than I wanna spend though. I'm really just looking for something to toy around town on. I'm well past the age of needin a bike that can do 0 to 60 in half a second.

The 450SS is a twin.

[BobL]

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

The 450SS is a twin.

Yes, and it's also $ 1000 more, and the same MSRP as the 400 Ninja. Don't get me wrong, they are both nice looking bikes, but for the price, I'd go with the Kawa before going with a China bike.

[JerryHawk250]

Originally Posted by BobL

Yes, and it's also $ 1000 more, and the same MSRP as the 400 Ninja. Don't get me wrong, they are both nice looking bikes, but for the price, I'd go with the Kawa before going with a China bike.

I've checked around at some of the local dealerships and they are selling $800-$1000 below MSRP. They have a bunch of leftover 2022 models. I'm sure they will be willing to make a deal.

[Thumper]

The arrival of a true 250 (ZS172FMM) in a dual purpose convert last year (Templar series) was a game changer, and the more refined KPX with EFI was a good complementary option in the street legal full sized dirtbike. Orion's EFI RXB 250 is another slightly different option in a street legal 20hp dirtbike.

Dual purpose isn't really a street bike, but it is a popular streetable category.

My entry point was a 230cc Storm, which is still a great value and there are many similar bargain bikes with that powerplant. I put a BIG and wide Tusk DSport on the Storm and it is a real goat! My son loves it. He uses it on the street to get to school and the pool (lifeguarding).

But I'd like to see water cooled OHC NC300cc or better yet NC450 street legal version of these bargain level dual sport bikes. Kove 450 is here (GPX is selling the rally), but it is real expensive. You see lower priced 450s in other markets, but not in North America. And it would be great to see the more competition for 2 stroke 250s and even 300s. GPX has them but again, on the pricey side.

The new thing is the adventure sport look with way too much weight high up for anything but pavement (in my opinion). It's the new "look". But I'd rather just find a used inline 4 cylinder 650 to 1000cc standard (or a used Bonneville!) and work on suspension upgrades and panniers for touring. Lower center of gravity means better cornering.

[ChopperCharles]

I agree about the Hayalon. There are a lot of better, cheaper alternatives if you want a naked sport bike. The bike would have to have been really, really good, or really, really cheap to sell. But the SG400 I think is a winner. Nobody else - nobody - makes a neo retro cafe racer and the next closest thing is a Royal Enfield 650... which has a $6000 MSRP, so probably closer to $6800 out the door. It doesn't have neo-retro styling tho, just retro styling. Then there's the Kawasaki z650RS, which is neo-retro but not a cafe... and a whopping $9000 bucks. The z900RS is even more. That's it, those are the only bikes even remotely like the SG400.

Obviously CSC was having a hard time moving the Hayalons, as they cut the price by a grand last year, and are not currently selling them anymore. (They're not on the CSC website) Meaning they sold all old stock and aren't going to get any new, in all likelihood. The SG400 is still on their site though, so it's obviously selling well enough to keep it around.

Charles.

[N7sithis]

Originally Posted by Megadan

Simplest explanation I can give.

SG400 + processing fees and delivery costs = $5300
RZ3S Haylon 400 + processing and shipping at current sale price = $4600

2022 Yamaha MT03 + dealer fees at local dealership = $5100
2023 MT03 + Fees = $5400

MT03 is 50lbs lighter, makes 14 more hp, has a ton of factory and aftermarket support all over the country.

There are a ton of other big brand bikes in that category and the comparison is basically the same.

Meanwhile, in the cheap Hawk and Hawk like bike category.

KLX230 out the door = $5300
My Hawk delivered $1400. My silly number of upgrades cost about as much as the bike. Still half the price.
A KPX250, a very good bike to compare to the KLX is still 2 grand less. The KLX does have some advantages, sure, but for most guys doing light off road and street duty, you won take advantage of it.

That's why the cheap Hawk bikes are so prolific, and why nobody buys the bigger class of bikes available. The appeal was always in the cost savings, and there isn't enough savings. If the RZ3S Haylon 400 was 4k delivered, It would sell like the KPX250.

As usual, this man has the answer.

IMO the whole point in buying a Chinese bike was to get in easy and cheap - less than 2k for my hawk after taxes and shipping, which Amazon let me use my amazon card for, so i pay $120 a month for my bike. I cannot afford 5grand upfront for a bike, and if I'm gonna make that big of a purchase, might as well buy a used Japanese bike. Hell, for 5gs you can get a new Japanese bike lol

[BobL]

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

I've checked around at some of the local dealerships and they are selling $800-$1000 below MSRP. They have a bunch of leftover 2022 models. I'm sure they will be willing to make a deal.

I have a 'big four' dealer about 15 minutes from me, listed on the CFMOTO website as a dealer. All they have in stock are quads. There is another dealer listed, roughly an hour away. All they have is 2023's. Any dealer that is 'local enough' for me to consider even looking, doesn't have stock. There's actually a pair of Harley dealers listed, but neither have any stock at all. That's also a weird concept to me, American and Chinese under the same roof. Sounds like someone's playing a joke.

[tknj99]

Not so weird indeed as Harleys have some of their parts produced in China but yea made in America lol

[ChopperCharles]

Originally Posted by N7sithis

As usual, this man has the answer.

IMO the whole point in buying a Chinese bike was to get in easy and cheap - less than 2k for my hawk after taxes and shipping, which Amazon let me use my amazon card for, so i pay $120 a month for my bike. I cannot afford 5grand upfront for a bike, and if I'm gonna make that big of a purchase, might as well buy a used Japanese bike. Hell, for 5gs you can get a new Japanese bike lol

If that's the case, then this site shouldn't be called "chinariders", it should be called "cheapskateriders", "miserriders", "dirtcheapriders", or something similar.

Charles.

[Working_ZS]

Originally Posted by ChopperCharles

I agree about the Hayalon. There are a lot of better, cheaper alternatives if you want a naked sport bike. The bike would have to have been really, really good, or really, really cheap to sell. But the SG400 I think is a winner. Nobody else - nobody - makes a neo retro cafe racer and the next closest thing is a Royal Enfield 650... which has a $6000 MSRP, so probably closer to $6800 out the door. It doesn't have neo-retro styling tho, just retro styling. Then there's the Kawasaki z650RS, which is neo-retro but not a cafe... and a whopping $9000 bucks. The z900RS is even more. That's it, those are the only bikes even remotely like the SG400.

Obviously CSC was having a hard time moving the Hayalons, as they cut the price by a grand last year, and are not currently selling them anymore. (They're not on the CSC website) Meaning they sold all old stock and aren't going to get any new, in all likelihood. The SG400 is still on their site though, so it's obviously selling well enough to keep it around.

Charles.

I believe that the Haylon was a "freebie" - meaning that since it used the exact same TC380 engine as the SG400, it was able to piggyback on the same EPA/CARB approval and was a low risk venture for CSC. There were bound to be a few people who would buy one at MSRP, and if/when sales slowed, CSC could blow them out at cost and recoup their investment, as they've done. The SG400 was the prize all along. It will be interesting to see how the RX6 plays out; I'm in, if you're curious, I paid my deposit yesterday. I'll be getting rid of my Versys 650....hopefully that vaunted "Japanese resale value" doesn't let me down, lol.

And to address the original thread question - I believe it is due to the fact that we are a bunch of old farts, relatively speaking. Most younger generations do not frequent old style forums, it's pretty much social media all the way - Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, and now TikTok. I glance at CSC's Facebook page from time to time and I see gobs of posts and questions from folks who I know I'll never see on these forums in a million years. CSC is obviously selling a ton of bikes and making money doing it, the fact that they are still here eight years later, alive and well and bringing in more and more bikes backs that up.

Now why aren't there more actual reviews? Easy...that shit takes time and money. A decent GoPro set up and video editing software, plus a high enough spec computer to run it and edit 4K footage ain't cheap. While everyone on ChinaRiders pretty much are, by their own admission. And yes, it has to be 4K or everyone will bitch about it not being 4K in the comments. Then you have to actually buy the bike. Which no one wants to do because if it's more than $2000, then they will just look for a "good, used Japanese bike". Horseshit to that, I say - but that's just me. I've spent damn near $25,000 on Chinese motorcycles, plus another $11,000 on "good, used Japanese bikes" in the last nine years and as far as differences in quality go, from the RX4 onward their aren't any. If you buy Japanese, you spend more and get less, plain and simple. Look at the CF Moto 800MT and 700CX bikes, and now the RX6, plus the Benelli offerings, and tell me which Japanese bikes at those price points can go toe to toe with them. Let me answer that for you - none.

The Chinese aren't screwing around anymore, they're bringing guns to a knife fight, intending to win. They're not confining themselves to the cheap 150cc-230cc CB or CG clone dual sport arena these days. Instead, they're going after the 400cc and up playground, which due to cost appears to not be ChinaRider territory. Which is OK by me, I don't need to see my bike reviewed to confirm to me that I made a good purchase. I do that myself by riding the damn thing. Hell who knows, someday I might even buy a GoPro and review my bikes myself, but it's not a priority right now, though apparently my pre-ordered RX6 has front and rear cameras built in, soooo maybe that bike gets reviewed first...we'll have to play it by ear.