Frostbite - political activist

[MrsTrubattleax]

BEST OF LUCK...THATS RIDICULOUS.. IS THERE ANYTHING WE CAN DO TO HELP...?BY THE WAY, YOUR DAUGHTER IS A REAL CUTIE

[IronFist]

BUMP!

Well it's happened in Ontario. Second reading of bill C117. The bill is to ban all passengers under 14. On everything.

http://www.wheels.ca/reviews/article/485681

The news article describes it and gets to the impitus of the bill. Divorced mother doesn't want her kid on the back of the divorced father's bike. Outlawing all fathers from taking their kids riding because of an ugly divorce is such a bunch of crap it should dropped. The politician has 144 records of injury, yet the authority( MTO) says that the number of reported injuries in the last decade is ZERO. It's a private member's backbencher bill and they rarely get to a second reading. This one was read and passed. 1 more step and it becomes law, likely for EVER. Sometimes Canada makes no sense, and Ontario seems confused.

[katoranger]

I don't think that really small kids need to be riding as passengers, but a law is not needed to determine that.

Small kids will fall asleep on the back. Yes it happens and it the reason a friend of mine won't take his twin girls for rides of more than a few miles. They fall asleep.

An 8 year old can understand what they need to do. A 5 year old probably not.

Still don't need a law for it though.

Allen

[VinceDrake]

You know, I wonder if Saskatchewan were to enact such a ban, how in the world we would ever get any combining done?

--Vince

[katoranger]

These people making the laws have no idea about farm life.

If you could reach the clutch pedal and the brakes you drove a tractor.

I remember driving a G John Deere when I was 7. It had a hand clutch.

I am from the American version of Sask. IOWA.


Allen

[IronFist]

20 when I first drove a car, 40 a bike for the first time.

The problem is that 1 branch of the gov says lots of kid in bike accidents, another branch says zero accidents with kids as passengers. :?

And the impetus for the law is a disagreement between 2 disgruntled divorcee's? :evil:

[warrior91]

Originally Posted by katoranger

These people making the laws have no idea about farm life.

If you could reach the clutch pedal and the brakes you drove a tractor.

I remember driving a G John Deere when I was 7. It had a hand clutch.
Allen

I am from the American version of Sask. IOWA.
Allen[/quote]

LOL this is my gov't... All True...and only happened in the last year.
http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/archives/008248.html

I drove the old 4020 @ 7 and had fuel truck duties in a 50's IHC @9.
Never killed anyone or broke anything...
I did have the fear of God and parents enough not to fart around on the grid road and drive like an idiot...Though I might have done a few doughnuts in the field by 11 or so.
LOL , My 12 year old girl gets a crack at driving this year.

Looking at my town raised son, I can't imagine letting him behind the wheel of anything more than his quad or Lawntractor...never mind Swathing alone in a Field....I guess Farm kids are a little more serious about work and the necesity of cheap labour (free) to farm productivity.
More work/ less horseplay pays the bills.

[Jim]

Pfft... BC's premiere was convicted of driving under the influence.

[tigertamer]

Those are some cute "muggies" :twisted:

We have our scanadalous leaders as well :!:

Tigertamer

[BillR]

Originally Posted by culcune

Not that AZ is that great of a state (see some other unrelated posts), but I did dig this up from the AZ Fish and Game Dept's site in response to a recent 14 year-olds death on an ATV. (There was a death just last week here in Yuma by a 10 year old on a quad)

http://www.azgfd.gov/artman/publish/article_717.shtml

I think that the typical desert rat/white trash Arizona parent will bitch and moan over the law between beers, but it does allow their kids to ride with safety equipment on. It's one thing to ride without a helmet being an adult, but under 18, if its a law, at least the few who die each year in AZ might not have died in vain. Besides, motocross helmets look really cool!

I work in an emergency room. Nothing like hearing the EMS report for an injured 10yr old, ATV, unhelmeted, unknown time for loss of consciousness, NO WITNESSES :!:
And I quote: "We hadn't seen 'im for 'bout 2 hours."

I was visiting my hometown back in October and as I was driving down the road; I saw a Honda Recon come flying around a barn. The driver looked to be about 8 yrs old, and the other 2 passengers were stairsteps, 'bout 4 and 2. No helmets, no adult visible anywhere.

Go after the irresponsible "parent" that allowed that to happen.

I totally disagree with banning something because of a few peoples' stupidity.
I did sign the petition.

I vividly remember a petition in my county to allow sale of alcohol (it is still "dry).
I signed to support the sale (I was a beer drinker then).
I noticed most of the guys that I hung around with had signed on the "Do Not Allow" side. Drink on Saturday night, go to church on Sunday. Gotta keep up appearances :P

And don't get me started on drinking and driving :evil:
I don't go to our department parties 'cause most everyone else drinks alcohol of some kind.
And guess how they got to the party and how they will get back home...........THEY DROVE THEIR OWN CAR :!:
Talk about a double standard :!:
Bill

[Willys]

I'm against the law too...BUT!!!

I also think all people who operate a motorized machine of any kind need to have proper training and be certified for said machine..tractors, ATV's, sleds, cars, trucks, bikes anything!

Buying a bike or ATV for your kid and using it as a baby sitting service is criminal!!! And many parents do this!
I have bought my daughter mini bikes and now a china Hybird 200cc bike. She's 13...she rides in the fields behind our house..I have spent many many hours teaching and watching her untill I felt she could ride safely and well enough to almost pass the road test. I modified the bikes to go slower to allow her to be able to use all gears and still stay below 40mph in 5th! She is a good rider now because of this...IMHO..could she ride the road..maybe..but she isn't allowed and won't be until she gets that endorsement, licience like the rest of us..period!

I also have an issue with getting possibly rearended with her on the back of my bike....I've had 3 close calles with her on the back!!! I don't know what I would do to the person if they hit us....I'm sure they would need hospitalization!!! This alone has stopped me from taking her many places for fear she could get hurt.

But to ban kids from going for a ride under a law is silly...mind you....I feel they still should ahve to be able to rest their feet on the foot rests if nothing else. So..if there has to be a law.then that should be the stipulation to who can and can't ride on the back of a bike! So...for even the really short adults out there watch out...lol

[IronFist]

Originally Posted by Willys

I'm against the law too...BUT!!!

I also think all people who operate a motorized machine of any kind need to have proper training and be certified for said machine..tractors, ATV's, sleds, cars, trucks, bikes anything!

Buying a bike or ATV for your kid and using it as a baby sitting service is criminal!!! And many parents do this!
I have bought my daughter mini bikes and now a china Hybird 200cc bike. She's 13...she rides in the fields behind our house..I have spent many many hours teaching and watching her untill I felt she could ride safely and well enough to almost pass the road test. I modified the bikes to go slower to allow her to be able to use all gears and still stay below 40mph in 5th! She is a good rider now because of this...IMHO..could she ride the road..maybe..but she isn't allowed and won't be until she gets that endorsement, licience like the rest of us..period!

I also have an issue with getting possibly rearended with her on the back of my bike....I've had 3 close calles with her on the back!!! I don't know what I would do to the person if they hit us....I'm sure they would need hospitalization!!! This alone has stopped me from taking her many places for fear she could get hurt.

But to ban kids from going for a ride under a law is silly...mind you....I feel they still should ahve to be able to rest their feet on the foot rests if nothing else. So..if there has to be a law.then that should be the stipulation to who can and can't ride on the back of a bike! So...for even the really short adults out there watch out...lol

Bill C117 does not cover atv's. Just prevents you from taking your daughter or son out with you when you ride. Does not cover your daughter driving, just as a passenger. I hope to get my full motorcycle licence, next year if the timing works with the riding season.

In Ontario it takes between 2 3/4 and 5 years to get your M licence.
The first test is written. 3 months later it expires, unless you pass a closed course skills test. If you've taken motorcycle training, you can take your 3rd and final highway test 2 1/2 years later. No training and you have to wait 3 years. I took the training, 16 hours, $500. I will take more training before my final test. $500. Then I'll take my highway test. No passengers till you at least pass the skills test. Maybe no passengers till you get the full licence is a good idea? 3 years.

I don't think the people driving kids to school in all those yellow school busses with no seat belts on snowy roads get the same training. :?

I don't have kids. I don't ride with my dogs. My wife never gets on a bike. I don't like the fact that the law's origin is from a disgruntled ex-wife, and not from MTO statistics. I don't know where the politician got her stats from, but it's not from MTO. Because of a disgruntled ex-wife my brother was charged with abusing his kids, (all worked out after 5 years of court costs and forensic mental health techs. They both live with their dad now.) But the truth is that people do, and say, strange things when going through a divorce, I don't think it's a sound foundation for making laws (except for divorce laws )

In my vintage club, the tension that this Bill creates shocked me. Vintage riding dads seem to enjoy spending time with their kids, and their bikes. As I don't have kids, I'm not effected at all. I did think that the folks down south, (our American members) were gonna laugh at our crazy canuk legal system. Just when I think people are gonna side a certain way on this issue, I get blindsided. Psycologicly, it's been an odd experiment asking different people what they think. The data is hard to bring together, and make sense of. The only demographic that has made any sense is that "people that do a lot of group riding, tend to think that kids under 14 are fine on the backs of bikes.

[Willys]

I'm not disagreeing with you...just adding my 2 cents worth...lol

Some folks just need to be nuetered at birth!!! lol

My parents were devorced when I was 17 and my brother 12....my mother did all she could to poison us towards our father....not that he was innocent..but she tried to finish him off mentally! Biatch!

Oh well......like i said...my only concern would be being able to touch the pegs. I have seen very small kids riding behind their dads trying to hold on as best they can clutching the dad's leather coat not being able to get their arms fully around his waist with their legs flying all over because they weren't capable of reaching the pegs. How the hell can they safely stay on the bike in an emergency type manover? I would bet they come flying off like in an instant.....that is my only gripe with some people and letting their kids ride on the back.....some can't even see them back there to see if they have or are about to fall asleep....yes it isn't the norm at all...but I have seen a few.

I used to have my son ride between my legs when he was really small, but only once or twice...I was then pressured to sell my bike until the kids were older or it wasn't an interest for me any longer..she wished...lol


But no...they shouldn'd completely just rule no-one under 14 should be allowed to ride on the back....IMHO! Common sence should be the judge and if not there are plenty of people out there who can make a call and have the police involved if it is that dangerous.

[IronFist]

Totally agree.

A throne, with roll bar and safety straps could be made for some of the Harleys I've seen.

I can see the danger of a kid under 8 on the back of his dad's 1964 Triumph bonni. Man, I wouldn't like sitting on the back of a flat seat, holding on to that little strap. 8O

[Jim]

I'd love to one day do a cross Canada bike trip, it's too bad I will have to detour around Ontario :P