Transmission First Gear Difficulty

ddilink · 05-30-2023, 04:14 PM

I have a Magician that shifts very well through the gears, but is very difficult to get out of first gear, especially when it's hot. I think I have the clutch adjusted properly. Running synthestic oil if that's an issue?
Thanks for all help.
Vince

**JerryHawk250** · 05-30-2023, 04:38 PM

It's normal on the CG engines when new. It will get better after about 1500 miles. Properly adjusted free play will also help. Running an oil cooler will help a good bit. Mine had no more issues after installing the oil cooler.

Megadan · 05-30-2023, 06:13 PM

The stock clutches are somewhat notorious for clutch fade when they get hot. I had to fight it all the time in the summer. The clutch adjustment you make when the engine is cold actually goes slightly out of adjustment and starts to drag.

Putting on an oil cooler helped quite a bit by helping to prolong and dissipate heat from the engine rapidly. Thus making the clutch in particular cooler faster and preventing the fade issue.

After installing ebc csk41 clutch springs most of that issue has now been resolved.

ddilink · 06-01-2023, 10:24 AM

Thank you Megadan

Megadan · 06-01-2023, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddilink

Thank you Megadan

Of course. Something you can try in the meantime. Once it gets hot and you start having issues, make a small adjustment at the lever adjuster. I used to do this all the time, and adding maybe an extra turn out helped. After a while I just left it there. It was definitely on the snug side of adjustment when cold (almost no free play at all), but it never slipped or gave me any issues. I just took it easy for a few minutes until thing warmed up.

ddilink · 06-01-2023, 01:49 PM

I will try this right away. Maybe a new clutch?

**JerryHawk250** · 06-01-2023, 01:51 PM

Nothing wrong with your clutch. It's pretty issue common on the CG engine.

ddilink · 06-01-2023, 03:41 PM

Thanks Again

Megadan · 06-01-2023, 03:49 PM

You could try new plates and fibers, but it likely wont do a whole lot. Try the springs first. They are less than or right around 10 bucks for the set and only take a couple of hours to do. Great improvement in clutch feel without actually making it much heavier at the lever. The stock springs are.kinda craptastic, and are likely one of the factors causing the clutch fade.
Springs: https://www.amazon.com/EBC-Brakes-Cl...74402155&psc=1

My stock springs were all slightly different lengths, which tells me the steel used is either a very low grade, or the tempering process quality control position requires a blindfold.

The oil cooler did the most good for my bike, and I feel is almost necessary for a bike that sees regular use above 55mph for extended periods.of time. Also makes the oil last a heck of a lot longer. I can stretch my oil changes out to almost 2k miles.

If you arent into fab work, motocult offers a kit with a bracket to mount it to the Hawk and similar bikes. More expensive than DIY, but it is nice to have a simple bolt on option.
https://motocultparts.com/products/c...42940243804359

If you don't want to spend that much or don't want it mounted down low like that kid mounts it I can take a picture of how I installed mine. Will save you a good bit of money.

ddilink · 06-01-2023, 04:23 PM

I don't run this bike at extended speeds so probbly don't need an oil cooler. I did notice the transmission shifted smoother with synthetic oil.

Got good plce to get plates besides Texas Powersports?

Boatguy · 06-01-2023, 08:47 PM

Yeah. In my experience using the synthetic was pretty good for the shifting as well.

once I switched from the Rotella break in oil to the synthetic forever oil, the shifting definitely got a little bit more smooth.

I had trouble getting into neutral on mine. It would always skip over neutral. Except when I was at a stoplight. Then it would just go right into neutral from first lol.

all of that gradually went away. It will get better. It has the break in just like everyone is saying.

ddilink · 06-02-2023, 09:47 PM

Thaks guys. Very helpful. I ordered the springs. I'll let you know what happens

Megadan · 06-02-2023, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddilink

Thaks guys. Very helpful. I ordered the springs. I'll let you know what happens

They are a worthwhile upgrade no matter what. If you do decide to go down that path the options for clutch plates are out there, mostly more chinese made clutch sets. You can order individual fibers and plates from CSC, but they charge quite a bit for them from what I saw. I haven't yet had the chance to try and match them up to whatever OEM Honda clutch they are based off of yet. Likely just CG125 clutches, but just more of them.

ddilink · 06-03-2023, 11:03 AM

The springs will be here tomorrow. Thanks again

ddilink · 06-12-2023, 05:44 PM

I installed the new springs. Shifting is a little smoother. Still can's get it into neutral when it's hot. I'll try to adjust.

05-30-2023, 04:14 PM	#1
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	Transmission First Gear Difficulty I have a Magician that shifts very well through the gears, but is very difficult to get out of first gear, especially when it's hot. I think I have the clutch adjusted properly. Running synthestic oil if that's an issue? Thanks for all help. Vince
	0

05-30-2023, 04:38 PM	#2
JerryHawk250 Moderator Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Houma, La. Posts: 11,550	It's normal on the CG engines when new. It will get better after about 1500 miles. Properly adjusted free play will also help. Running an oil cooler will help a good bit. Mine had no more issues after installing the oil cooler. __________________ 2023 Lifan Lycan 250 Chopper 2023 Venom Evader 2022 Lifan KPX250 2020 Kawasaki Vulcan S 2004 Honda ST 1300 2016 Black Hawk 250 (sold) Keihin PE30 carb,125 main,38 slow.Pod filter,ported & decked head 10:1 CR,Direct Ignition Coil,15/40Sprockets,NGK DPR8EIX-9,De-Cat,Dual Oil Cooler,Digital Cluster 2016 Cazador180 XL 2014 Coolster150 JerryHawk250.com My YouTube Channel Last edited by JerryHawk250; 05-30-2023 at 05:34 PM.
	1

05-30-2023, 06:13 PM	#3
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 7,969	The stock clutches are somewhat notorious for clutch fade when they get hot. I had to fight it all the time in the summer. The clutch adjustment you make when the engine is cold actually goes slightly out of adjustment and starts to drag. Putting on an oil cooler helped quite a bit by helping to prolong and dissipate heat from the engine rapidly. Thus making the clutch in particular cooler faster and preventing the fade issue. After installing ebc csk41 clutch springs most of that issue has now been resolved. __________________ Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 2024 Royal Enfield Shotgun 650 https://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=34124 Last edited by Megadan; 06-01-2023 at 03:52 PM.
	1

06-01-2023, 01:51 PM	#7
JerryHawk250 Moderator Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Houma, La. Posts: 11,550	Nothing wrong with your clutch. It's pretty issue common on the CG engine. __________________ 2023 Lifan Lycan 250 Chopper 2023 Venom Evader 2022 Lifan KPX250 2020 Kawasaki Vulcan S 2004 Honda ST 1300 2016 Black Hawk 250 (sold) Keihin PE30 carb,125 main,38 slow.Pod filter,ported & decked head 10:1 CR,Direct Ignition Coil,15/40Sprockets,NGK DPR8EIX-9,De-Cat,Dual Oil Cooler,Digital Cluster 2016 Cazador180 XL 2014 Coolster150 JerryHawk250.com My YouTube Channel
	1

06-01-2023, 03:41 PM	#8
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	Thanks Again Thanks Again
	0

06-01-2023, 10:24 AM	#4
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	Thank you Megadan
	1

06-01-2023, 01:49 PM	#6
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	I will try this right away. Maybe a new clutch?
	0

06-01-2023, 03:49 PM	#9
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 7,969	You could try new plates and fibers, but it likely wont do a whole lot. Try the springs first. They are less than or right around 10 bucks for the set and only take a couple of hours to do. Great improvement in clutch feel without actually making it much heavier at the lever. The stock springs are.kinda craptastic, and are likely one of the factors causing the clutch fade. Springs: https://www.amazon.com/EBC-Brakes-Cl...74402155&psc=1 My stock springs were all slightly different lengths, which tells me the steel used is either a very low grade, or the tempering process quality control position requires a blindfold. The oil cooler did the most good for my bike, and I feel is almost necessary for a bike that sees regular use above 55mph for extended periods.of time. Also makes the oil last a heck of a lot longer. I can stretch my oil changes out to almost 2k miles. If you arent into fab work, motocult offers a kit with a bracket to mount it to the Hawk and similar bikes. More expensive than DIY, but it is nice to have a simple bolt on option. https://motocultparts.com/products/c...42940243804359 If you don't want to spend that much or don't want it mounted down low like that kid mounts it I can take a picture of how I installed mine. Will save you a good bit of money. __________________ Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 2024 Royal Enfield Shotgun 650 https://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=34124
	0

06-01-2023, 04:23 PM	#10
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	Oil Cooler I don't run this bike at extended speeds so probbly don't need an oil cooler. I did notice the transmission shifted smoother with synthetic oil. Got good plce to get plates besides Texas Powersports?
	0

06-01-2023, 08:47 PM	#11
Boatguy Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: Northeast Posts: 929	Yeah. In my experience using the synthetic was pretty good for the shifting as well. once I switched from the Rotella break in oil to the synthetic forever oil, the shifting definitely got a little bit more smooth. I had trouble getting into neutral on mine. It would always skip over neutral. Except when I was at a stoplight. Then it would just go right into neutral from first lol. all of that gradually went away. It will get better. It has the break in just like everyone is saying. __________________ 2020 Lifan x-pect
	1

06-02-2023, 09:47 PM	#12
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	Shifting Thaks guys. Very helpful. I ordered the springs. I'll let you know what happens
	0

06-03-2023, 11:03 AM	#14
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	First gear The springs will be here tomorrow. Thanks again
	0

06-12-2023, 05:44 PM	#15
ddilink Join Date: Oct 2019 Location: Michigan Posts: 36	I installed the new springs. Shifting is a little smoother. Still can's get it into neutral when it's hot. I'll try to adjust.
	0