TT250/Hawk aftermarket clutch parts?

[Sullybiker]

Does anyone know if some of the popular OEM clutch kit suppliers (Barnett, EBC, Tusk) have plate sets that would fit our bikes?

I'm wondering if some of the Honda kits would work. I have a full set of spare fibres and steels but I don't want to fit them just yet as I suspect they won't be much of an improvement.

The clutch is the only part of the bike I'm not totally satisfied with.

[Ariel Red Hunter]

Originally Posted by Sullybiker

Does anyone know if some of the popular OEM clutch kit suppliers (Barnett, EBC, Tusk) have plate sets that would fit our bikes?

I'm wondering if some of the Honda kits would work. I have a full set of spare fibres and steels but I don't want to fit them just yet as I suspect they won't be much of an improvement.

The clutch is the only part of the bike I'm not totally satisfied with.

What don't you like about the clutch?

[Sullybiker]

Originally Posted by Ariel Red Hunter

What don't you like about the clutch?

As soon as the bike is up to temperature the plates swell and warp a little, if you're in stop/go it gets quite ill tempered. Judder is quite severe under this condition as well. If it's hot - say above 85F - it is particularly difficult, as the clutch bites early, then hard.

It's little I can't live with, but I'd like to see if I can improve it.

[Ariel Red Hunter]

Originally Posted by Sullybiker

As soon as the bike is up to temperature the plates swell and warp a little, if you're in stop/go it gets quite ill tempered. Judder is quite severe under this condition as well. If it's hot - say above 85F - it is particularly difficult, as the clutch bites early, then hard.

It's little I can't live with, but I'd like to see if I can improve it.

I suppose the first thing I would do is take off the clutch cover on the right side, pull out the spark plug, pull the handle bar clutch lever tight against the grip, and kick it over. Kick it over several times to make sure the spring plate has virtually no run out. If it has runout, adjust the clutch springs until the plate has virtually no runout. If it has no runout, the problem is either rider technique, or too much slack in the clutch cable. Rider technique has to do with waiting in gear with the clutch pulled in at long traffic lights or stop and go traffic. Wet clutches heat up under that scenerio. That causes warpage and friction material swelling. Too much slack in the clutch cable is the other cause. ...ARH

[Sullybiker]

Originally Posted by Ariel Red Hunter

I suppose the first thing I would do is take off the clutch cover on the right side, pull out the spark plug, pull the handle bar clutch lever tight against the grip, and kick it over. Kick it over several times to make sure the spring plate has virtually no run out. If it has runout, adjust the clutch springs until the plate has virtually no runout. If it has no runout, the problem is either rider technique, or too much slack in the clutch cable. Rider technique has to do with waiting in gear with the clutch pulled in at long traffic lights or stop and go traffic. Wet clutches heat up under that scenerio. That causes warpage and friction material swelling. Too much slack in the clutch cable is the other cause. ...ARH

Are you saying the pressure plate may not be evenly distributing pressure due to differing torque on the springs? That would make sense. I'll definitely take a look at that.

As for rider technique, I am aware of the problem precisely because I don't like to leave it in gear; I habitually prefer the bike in neutral at lights, if for nothing else to relax my hands.

[Ariel Red Hunter]

Originally Posted by Sullybiker

Are you saying the pressure plate may not be evenly distributing pressure due to differing torque on the springs? That would make sense. I'll definitely take a look at that.

As for rider technique, I am aware of the problem precisely because I don't like to leave it in gear; I habitually prefer the bike in neutral at lights, if for nothing else to relax my hands.

Yes, or the springs themselves could have different spring rates. Yes, I wish that Barnett offered springs for these clutches, because we KNOW Barnett clutch springs are matched for spring rate, and length. One possible solution would be to order 2 or 3 full sets of clutch springs from CSC and mix and match until you have a matched set...ARH

[pete]

i have quite a few diffrent EBC clutch spring sets
from bikes over the years...
give me the dimentions of your springs & I will see if they
match any of the heavy duty EBC springs...
then I just maybe able to tell yer what bike has the same size springs..

IE.... length / OD / ID


...

[Sullybiker]

Originally Posted by pete

i have quite a few diffrent EBC clutch spring sets
from bikes over the years...
give me the dimentions of your springs & I will see if they
match any of the heavy duty EBC springs...
then I just maybe able to tell yer what bike has the same size springs..

IE.... length / OD / ID


...

Okay, as soon as I've got them (not sure when) I'll measure them up and reply to this thread.

[jimwildman]

Originally Posted by Sullybiker

As soon as the bike is up to temperature the plates swell and warp a little, if you're in stop/go it gets quite ill tempered. Judder is quite severe under this condition as well. If it's hot - say above 85F - it is particularly difficult, as the clutch bites early, then hard.

It's little I can't live with, but I'd like to see if I can improve it.

I have this problem too. I dislike the clutch very much. If anyone has part numbers for some quality plates and steels I would order them today.

I thought I had just gotten a shitty clutch, as I havent heard any other complaints about it.

When it gets grabby like that I get frustrated and park it. Clutch control is everything.

[Ariel Red Hunter]

Originally Posted by jimwildman

I have this problem too. I dislike the clutch very much. If anyone has part numbers for some quality plates and steels I would order them today.

I thought I had just gotten a shitty clutch, as I havent heard any other complaints about it.

When it gets grabby like that I get frustrated and park it. Clutch control is everything.

The problem is the clutch was originally designed for a 125 cc engine. I can visualise it now: Well, bumping the engine to 229cc was a success. Transmission is handling it fine, but the clutch really needs an additional friction and drive plate, but the outer cover won't go over it. We've got to make the clutch cover deeper. No, says the cost control guy, do you have any idea what it will cost to modify the casting dies for that cover? Just put all the plates in you can get in the current clutch, and use heavier springs to make sure it doesn't slip. Everybody looks at the big boss, and he slowly nods.... ...ARH

[Megadan]

Mine doesn't act as severe as yours seems to, but once the motor and oil are up to temp mine would get a little grabby toward the latter end of the clutch throw and can give a small jerk forward starting off. I played with my clutch adjustment a bunch and got rid of most of it, but the only solution I have found to smooth it out is to give it some more revs.

The other issue I have been dealing with is actually the clutch adjustment needing re-adjusting once the bike is hot. If I set the free play with the bike cold and then get it up to temp, the clutch drags just enough with the lever pulled all the way back that it is almost impossible to get it out of gear. Once I re-adjust the clutch at the lever, it's fine until the bike gets cold, and then I have zero free play at the lever.

I am definitely on board for better clutch plates, discs, and springs.

[Mudflap]

One thing that can make the clutch chatter feel worse is loose engine mount bolts. As the engine pulls on the chain it moves back and forth slightly in the frame.

[Sullybiker]

Originally Posted by Megadan

Mine doesn't act as severe as yours seems to, but once the motor and oil are up to temp mine would get a little grabby toward the latter end of the clutch throw and can give a small jerk forward starting off. I played with my clutch adjustment a bunch and got rid of most of it, but the only solution I have found to smooth it out is to give it some more revs.

The other issue I have been dealing with is actually the clutch adjustment needing re-adjusting once the bike is hot. If I set the free play with the bike cold and then get it up to temp, the clutch drags just enough with the lever pulled all the way back that it is almost impossible to get it out of gear. Once I re-adjust the clutch at the lever, it's fine until the bike gets cold, and then I have zero free play at the lever.

I am definitely on board for better clutch plates, discs, and springs.

I found a sweet spot whereby I have to adjust it while it's hot, an leave just enough free play (about 2mm). As you say, when the engine cools it tightens the cable, but I've got it just so and don't have any slippage when cold.

As I said, it's liveable but not ideal. I've got quite adept at slipping it into neutral with a slight blip of the throttle.

I think the bigger problem from a precision point of view is the plates are biting with the lever just off the bar, not much, but effectively in the morning my friction zone is at the end of the travel, and by the end of my trip to work and some traffic, it's near the start.

I am tempted to call some vendors and see if they'd let me send some discs in.

[goat67]

I have the same issue I can not get the clutch adjusted the way I really want it.
I have a hell of a time getting into neutral.

I may not have it adjusted correctly I am not sure how much initial tension I
need to put on the engine side. I find it hard to know with the tension from the spring.

[jimwildman]

Originally Posted by goat67

I have the same issue I can not get the clutch adjusted the way I really want it.
I have a hell of a time getting into neutral.

I may not have it adjusted correctly I am not sure how much initial tension I
need to put on the engine side. I find it hard to know with the tension from the spring.

you have to adjust it tight cold, to have it just right hot.

I suspect the springs get weaker when hot, and may be the issue..

I bet they dont have the same tension when hot / or at all, making the clutch chatter. it could contribute to the grabby issue as well but I think the meterials used might not be so good.