Rebel T3 200cc Problems
 

Just got this quad, I already had a X31 250cc dirtbike purchased about 2 months ago which I love, other than replacing the crappy stock chain I have had no problems with it... other than tires are getting burned off, some quality ones on the way.

I have some experience with Chinese gas-powered vehicles, I have imported pocket bikes, dirt bikes, quads in the past.

The Rebel assembled fine, other than the rear rack didn't line up with the frame, had to whack it with a hammer to straighten it, the bars were crooked. Filled all connectors with dielectric grease, replaced those chrome Philips bolts that hold the body panels together, etc. with stainless steel ones, because those chrome ones always immediately rust as soon as they get wet. Rerouted and tie wrapped things properly, tightened all bolts...

It ran fine in my yard, did a few test cycles to make sure it was OK. Next morning, I pulled the carb and intake to check gaskets, it sounded like it was leaky. No problems, so I used some gasket compound to seal it anyways. Reassembled, changed the crap factory plug with an NGK.

So I get it out to our riding area, and the damn thing won't run unless the choke is all the way on. I check obvious stuff, nothing. Someone there tells me I MUST oil the air filter element, so we do that. No change. I pull the air filter and housing off, wondering if somehow the choke is backwards - nope, and I discover for some reason it won't run with the aircleaner assembly off?

I put the original plug back in - no change. Decide to look at the plug cap.. and the wire falls right out. Are these just jam fitted in there? Jam it back in, let the thing warm up for a while, finally runs reasonable but not much power, are these things supposed to run so hot?

At home today, decide to maybe change the plug wire and cap... is this wire molded right into the ignition coil? GREAT.... or is it?

I've got a "performance" Mikuni carb on the way from GIO, same one apparently as on my X31 dirtbike. The existing carb sure ain't a Mikuni, it has something else stamped on it.

Any suggestions I would appreciate it!

performance large cdi, got mine at gio auctions for 28 bucks shipped..

then look on ebay for a 200cc peformance coil, order it.. when you get it replace the wire and plug with a ngk one, get a uni filter or a open element air filter, and a performance muffler.. then jet the carb.

you can order the gio performance muffler, or run a fmf, hmf, dg whatever muffler.. i dont know a gio but mine is exactly the same way.. in the video sections look for my post called... fmf powercore 2 on a 200cc atv or something similar to that..

if you cant find jets local

rockymountainatvmc.com is a great place to get them.


one last thing, do a proper 4stroke engine break in on it..

i will find the write i posted here from a another site about the break in process

here you go, its easy and simple to do...


http://chinariders.net/modules.php?n...wtopic&t=10509

Re: Rebel T3 200cc Problems
 

I'm not too sure about the ignition wire as I've never had mine off of the cap. I know on my sons Mini Beast though, it just pushes on.

As far as the carb goes, it made all the difference in the world on mine. It runs much better with the Mikuni on it, no hesitation and revs till it sounds scary :). Ive had some problems with crud in the tank on mine too, so it might not hurt to flush that out if you get a chance. Your familiar with the build of the chinabikes so you know about the crappy fuel lines and shipping oil etc... Regular replacement stuff here.

Lots of Beast owners on here that have done major tweaking on their machines so I think you will get lots of good tips!

Cheers,
Stew

welcome to the site look here for some help too

http://www.chinariders.net/modules.p...ewtopic&t=9128

Hey,

Glad to see we have some more T3 Rebel members joining.

Like any new item out of the box it requires some tinkering to get it right.

It sounds to me like you need to do some carb tuning. As much as that other stuff is an irritant (plug wires etc) the biggest thing you are describing is all in your carb tune. Not running without choke or air cleaner etc.

You have three settings on your carb. An idle screw, an air/fuel screw, and your top cap removes to expose the needle which has position clips on it. You need to have the air/fuel screw and needle clip in the right positions for your altitude and temperature for your engine to run the way it's supposed to (smooth idle, making power, not too rich or too lean)

You've made the right step with the new carb en route. I'd probably wait for it to arrive and tune it accordingly. The stock carbs are really flakey for most.

The other advice in the posts is very valid for increased performance, but your quad should run fine with the better carb and no other upgrades, if you so choose to leave it like that.

..that is without us getting into the chain issue.

The stock coil should meet your needs, but the plug wire is a little weak, according to my multimeter. All that said, I have an early Beast, not a T3.

On every China machine I've had my hands on, the plug wire unscrews from the coil. All you need to do is peel back the rubber seal at the coil and you should have no trouble unscrewing the plug wire. I bought an NGK wire at Canadian Tire that is designed for a stud-type plug with a 90 degree boot. Totally worth it.

damn im going to have to track one of those down when i get my performance coil.. the plug wire that comes with them looks really cheap...

or i might just use one off my mustang when i do my next tune up..

Re: Rebel T3 200cc Problems
 

Oh yeah, forgot about that - replaced the fuel line with quality stuff, and the fuel filter. You are lucky if you get one season with the original line, before it rots away. Still have to do the same to the dirtbike, but it's a little harder to get at.

And I changed the oil.

Dang, I just finished an order from GIO, the Mikuni carb and the upgraded clutch and brake levers for the dirt bike. Never thought about a CDI.

"rockymountainatvmc.com" - I just ordered tires for my dirt bike from them! Guess I should have held off a few days....

I think for the time being I am just going to install an NGK cap, and the new Mikuni carb. Then source a new CDI, performance coil, filter and muffler.

Yeah, it is frustrating though, the X31 dirtbike required almost no tinkering, and I've been beating the trails every weekend with it. Other then sticking an NGK cap on the existing wire, I am gonna wait until the new carb arrives before I do anything with the quad.

Only reason I didn't replace the chain immediately, as I did with the dirtbike, is it doesn't have the size stamped on the links. So I need to pull the chain and take it with me to get a replacement.

A wishlist item for these Chinese units is I wish they would design some rubber engine mounts, instead of bolting them right to the frame. Would get rid of some of the vibration, and decrease the problem of frames breaking at motor mount points!

IIRC, the T3 uses a 530, but a bike shop will be able to confirm.

BTW, http://www.gnarlyparts.ca/ is in Canada, and they get alot of stock from rouckymountainatvmc, so the prices are similar. If you're anywhere near Chilliwack, BC you can even save the shipping.

The plug wire does INDEED unscrew from the ignition coil:
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images...ition.coil.jpg

So I replaced the wire with a performance one I had left from my truck:
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images...new.wire.1.jpg
Filled the cap with black automotive silicone sealant before I pushed it on.
Had to find a thread-on cap for my sparkplug, which can be a problem as a lot of them are molded right on the plugs now:
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images/quad/plugs.jpg
Done...still doesn't run properly though:
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images...new.wire.2.jpg

Removed carb and disassembled:
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images/quad/carb1.jpg
It sure ain't a Mikuni. Circled adjustment is idle... I thought it was the mixture screw!
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images/quad/carb2.jpg
Adjustment in the square is what I believe is the mixture adjustment.
Something I noticed was the fuel in the bowl was pouring out the circled port when I removed the carb - is this normal, a breather hole or something?
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images/quad/carb3.jpg
The needle. It is adjusted for the center position, which I left alone.
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images...arb.needle.jpg
I forgot to take a picture when I disassembled the bowl on the bottom. I see what I think are two removable jets down there. I wrote the numbers down, damned if I can find them now - center one was 94, the other was 33? (found it - 94 and 38 )

Regardless - I don't see anything wrong with the carb, nothing gunked up or sticking, everything moves freely. Bowl screws weren't that tight, nothing major.

Mikuni carb showed up today (100 jet in it), but no time to install and test. I notice the intake diameter is 30mm vs 27mm on the old one, but the bolt pattern is the same. Will likely have to take a Dremel tool to the intake pipe. Also, the choke hardware (spring, etc. for handlebar choke lever) fits right on the Mikuni.

ya its a simple swap over for the choke setup, good deal man.. i hope to have mine sometime next week. i want to go buy some main jets but seeing as how there is 3 different "styles" to the mikuni jets, i think im going to wait untill it gets here...

if you are all stock it should run just fine outside of setting the fuel screw and idle..

fuel screw is once you get it to idle, turn the fuel screw untill the idle starts to pick up its pace, then go back and turn the idle screw to lower the idle.

to check for the proper setting, dont think im wrong by this.. but rev the bike and you should NOT have any hesitation or stumble coming off of idle.

Been doing some reading on this "Mikuni" carb I got from GIO.... from what I understand, there is a high probability it is a Chinese fake. Regardless if it has Mikuni molded into it. Not the end of the world, but hopefully authentic Mikuni parts will fit it. Same carb on my dirt bike has been fine so far (fingers crossed...)

From what I read, and see stamped on the intake flange of this carb, it is a VM26-672U model.

EDITED TO ADD:
For example - http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/25...Dirt_bike.html
Identical to what I received.

Could be fake, wouldn't be surprised, but it works way better, and mikuni jets fit...and it's cheap.

http://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/se...rd=mikuni+jets

the top 9 are mikuni jets. not a 100% on this but i do believe that the hex headed jets are the real true mikuni jets ment for original mikuni carbs..

The hex head ones are what are used on the VM series, they are the jets that have been on every snowmobile that i've had with mikuni carbs, mikuni does make other models though that take different jets, the mikuni from GIO takes original mikuni jets for the main and pilot.

which one of these main jets?

Mikuni VM11/22 Series Main Jet
Mikuni N102/221 Series Main Jet
Mikuni N100.604 Series Main Jet

what about pilot jets

Pro X N224.103 Series Mikuni Pilot Jet
Pro X VM22/210 Series Mikuni Pilot Jet
Mikuni M28/1001 Series Pilot Jet

"Mikuni N100.604 Series Main Jet" is for the main jet but from what you've listed for pilots they don't match, one does look the same though, the normal mikuni pilots i get are the VM28/486 ones for my GIO upgrade carb.

which pilot looks the same ?

"Pro X N224.103 Series Mikuni Pilot Jet" that one looks close and is dimensioned, you'll have to check the dimensions with the real one, here's some link with the right jet and a few dimensions
http://www.jetsrus.com/a_jets_by_car...t_VM28-486.htm
http://www.motorcyclecarbs.com/MIKUN...__P5549C28.cfm

Pulled the carb off my X31 dirtbike i.e. "This is also a stock carburetor for 250cc Dirt Bike line up" to see what jets are installed, where the needle is set, etc. to use that as a starting point before I install the "Chikuni" carb on the T3.

Guess what? I have about had it with GIO:
http://www.topsecretbases.com/images...i.my.ass.1.jpg
What the f*** is this? K F???

I thought the carb on my X31 was the same as the upgrade carb i put on my beast, i ordered jets for the X31, took the carb off and found it was a keihin copy, not a mikuni, i had a spare GIO upgrade carb in the basement so i rejetted it and put that on the X31.

Well, the ad on GIO clearly states the bike has a Mikuni/Chikuni carb, and I am calling them on it, already started a support ticket.

It's one thing to put up with fit'n'finish BS because their prices are cheap, but I call this false advertising!

Good point, they do call it a mikuni carb, not a mikuni "type" carb.
Make sure you also replace your spark plug with a true NGK.

hey foster that is exact carb i have now.. its a knock of keihin, the pilot jet is a funky design and i have not found any other larger or smaller sizes that will work.. go with mikuni you will be happier as those are closer copies to a real mikuni then the keihin knock offs we have.

your not going to gain any performance if that carb has the letters pz30 on it as it is a 30mm carb same size as the gio upgrade carb.. but we will both gain more consitant jetting, easier jetting, and just better running..

Already changed the plug - tip for others, NAPA has these in stock, and cheap.

Also, the intake on these Rebel T3 quads is already 30mm, so a 30mm carb will bolt right on.

I get my plugs from Lorcdo out west here, also cheap. Always have them if you know the plug number.

Yeah i run the NGK DR8ES-L in my X31 and beast, their always in stock at my local canadian tire store, part # is 018-3928-6 and IIRC $6.99 a two pack.

Guess what... bitched to GIO, they are shipping me a Chikuni GRATIS!
They may actually move off my sh*t list, once I get this quad running.

It's been wet and cold as hell here in northern Alberta, but finally got around to installing the Chikuni on the Rebel T3 today.

Huge improvement over the carb it shipped with, at least it runs now and has some power! Didn't mess with the carb too much yet, it shipped with the e-clip on the needle valve right at the bottom, I moved it to the center position. Played a bit with the mixture screw, but didn't make a lot of difference, tried moving the e-clip down one notch, not much difference either. Will try and do a proper tune on it on a nice day. Just wanted the thing running so I could do some trail riding, see how it performed.

It still seems not to have the power it should, but then I am used to a dirtbike that weighs a lot less, with 50 more cc's. The skidplate under the rear axle was a nice idea, too bad it go busted off and destroyed on my first ride! Not surprising, being plastic. Think I might make one out of some sheet aluminum... and I think a performance muffler is in order as well.

Body panels vibrate like hell, as does the handlebars. Noticed the chain rubs against the cover over the front sprocket. Pulled chain tonight to get a replacement. I notice the front sprocket is kind of loose, as is the one on my X31 dirtbike. Is there a better quality one I can put on these?

Glad to hear you got it running. What part of Alberta are you in?

A skidplate under the rear axle is mandatory to protect the rotor and the chain. Along with a performance muffler, a performance CDI and some bigger jets will wake it up.

The front sprocket is supposed to be loose on a Honda type engine. It allows for minor chain / rear sprocket misalignment. If you remove it, you'll see how it's machined that way on purpose. The chain rube against the cover? That's a new one. There should be lots of clearance in there. Got pics?

I was surprised at first how my 200cc Beast seemed to be a gutless hunk of crap when I first got on it... this is me being used to a 250cc Yamaha YZ rocket ship.

With the uni, carb, cdi and exhaust installed it's a new animal. Still not hairy like the bike, but enough to make me chuckle when on it. With those upgrades you'll begin to appreciate the fun for cost factor.

Good luck with it. You're in good hands here with the folks in this forum. They know how to get the most bang out of these cheapo quads.

dont forgot to top off the mod list with a high performance ignition coil.. gives you double the spark voltage over stock..

sad part is they can only be found on ebay and run anywhere from 34.99 to 50 bucks. unless you order form hong kong but then its a 15-30 day delivery time

ya that coil is a must if u have a race cdi and ngk iridium spark plugs

found some for 24.99 plus 6 bucks or so for shipping.. will be ordering

mikuni carb
tach\hour meter
air filter
high performance coil

all this weekend or early next week, sweet part is all of them have free shipping except for the coil

Looking for a "performance" muffler now, but I'm not paying what GIO wants for one. Doesn't look like they show up on their auctions either. And I really don't to pay like $200-$300 for a namebrand muffler.

Got a new chain from Honda dealer yesterday, it appears to be a 530 chain. Drooled a bit over the quads in the showroom, then looked at the price and felt kind of smug... cheapest one started at like $8K. If I was going in the back-country where I needed something ultra-reliable, great...

Already have a "performance" CDI on the way for both the T3 and my dirtbike.

Also looking for a UNI or K&N airfilter. Should be easy enough to figure out, clamp on one for a 30mm carb. Would like to have a shield underneath it of some sort, may have to fabricate this when I fabricate the aluminum skidplate for the swingarm and rear axle.

I would like to see a stickied post on here for a list of upgrade parts, and updated sources for them and prices.