Chains

Nospark · 02-14-2022, 09:42 AM

I've been trying to understand all the info in here about chains. My new TBR showed up and I'm doing my best to follow Magadan's resource guide for the Hawk 250. I don't want to spend a lot of $ on upgrades out of the gate but, do want to make use of the bike arriving largely disassembled for upgrades that I know I'll want like, carb jetting and front sprocket. I had flight time for a work trip. Since there's no way you're gonna get a lap top open on a flight in coach anymore, I read the TBR7 owners manual cover to cover out of boredom. I was surprised it talked about the bike having an o-ring chain. I understood this type to be an upgrade over non-O-ring? In any event, my question is..... If it is in fact an O-ring chain, is it still a good practice to remove it and soak it in heavy gear oil?

Ol,fart · 02-14-2022, 12:46 PM

Yes. I use bar oil for chainsaws, its sticky and stays in the chain longer.
O-ring chains are good for dirt because the o rings keep dirt out but its also harder to get the oil in. Move the links around alot while it is soaking.

Nospark · 02-14-2022, 01:48 PM

I happen to have some bar oil. I'll take your advice. Thx

Megadan · 02-14-2022, 02:53 PM

O-ring chains don't need oil to get inside the O-ring. The O rings seal in the grease that the factory puts on the chain. The O-rings themselves can do with a little lubrication just to keep them from drying out and tearing from friction, but it doesn't take very much. I clean my O-ring chain and then use a dry lubricant and/or chain wax that is intended for o-ring chains. It's not as sticky as gear oil so it doesn't attract as much dirt.

For standard chains, yes the gear oil bath is a great idea. Or, a hot grease or paraffin wax bath. Since the rollers don't have lubrication sealed in with O-rings it is much more important that the lubricant gets into the rollers.

Nospark · 02-14-2022, 08:12 PM

Magadan, can you share specifics on the dry lube and chain wax brands you're using. I don't have either so, I might as well get what you're having good results with.

Megadan · 02-15-2022, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nospark

Magadan, can you share specifics on the dry lube and chain wax brands you're using. I don't have either so, I might as well get what you're having good results with.

This is the one I currently use. Muc-off dry lube.
https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/...sku_id=1297242

Another favorite of mine, but not a dry lube is PJ1 Blue Label that is designed as an O ring chain lube.
https://www.amazon.com/PJ1-1-08-Labe...000MYE398?th=1

As far as chain wax, If I do use it I tend to stick with Maxima brand as I have always had good luck with it.

I tend to cycle through different types of lubes to try new things and see if I can find something I like better.

KSSK · 02-14-2022, 08:26 PM

I'm surprised to hear the TBR7 comes with a sealed chain. My more expensive Lifan X-Pect came with a plain chain. I just installed a JT x-ring chain that was $40.

Have you looked to confirm it really is sealed?

Mudflap · 02-15-2022, 06:04 AM

I run my Oring chains dry except for a tiny amount of gear oil on the Orings every couple thousand miles to keep them from cracking. A dry chain doesn't attract dirt and grit that wear out the rollers and sprockets.

Nospark · 02-15-2022, 06:36 AM

As far as it coming with an O-ring chain, I am just going by what the manual says at this point. I will look at some pics on the web, educate myself what the two types look like, then confirm which is actually on the bike. It's certainly possible the manual could indicate O-ring when there isn't one on the bike. Out of town this week so will do that Sat.

TxTaoRider · 02-15-2022, 09:35 AM

My tbr7 came with a pretty gold chain, but it wasn't an o ring style.

Nospark · 02-22-2022, 10:33 AM

I have to conclude the TBR7 manual that came with the bike is incorrect. The bike did not come with an O-ring chain. I have a chain length problem. I went to replace the front sprocket and learned I bought a nice new 15 tooth to swap out a nice new 15 tooth. Didn't seem like much of a difference so I ordered the 17 tooth I intended to buy the first time. I'm almost certain my new chain that came with the bike is not going to be long enough to use a 17 tooth front sprocket. The chain adjusters were already maxed out with the 15 tooth and of course were adjusted way too tight as delivered. If I go with the 17 tooth front, I'll have a chain project. I wanted to try just the 17 tooth front and see if I wanted to swap rear later. Now I'm thinking If I swap the rear from the 46 as delivered to the 42 I bought, the stock chain will likely fit. Will I be happy with that gearing?

Nospark · 02-22-2022, 11:01 AM

The stamping on the stock chain is "CHOHO 428H" I'm pretty sure that's super high end professional racing grade and length. I'm ignorant about chains. Is 426 the number of lengths? What is the "H" designation?

Nospark · 02-22-2022, 11:13 AM

OK, Got the chain thing figured out, Chain size 428 which dictates pitch and inner width. Nothing to do with # of links. Back to my question on gearing... I believe others are running 17 front & 42 rear on TBR7's which is why I ordered these sprocket sizes. Can anyone comment on 1st hand experience with this combo?

Megadan · 02-22-2022, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nospark

I believe others are running 17 front & 42 rear on TBR7's which is why I ordered these sprocket sizes. Can anyone comment on 1st hand experience with this combo?

Yeah, just ask any Hawk owner with a 17 front 45 rear sprocket. Since the TBR7, Storm, and Brozz use the smaller 17" rear wheel, the total tire diameter being smaller means it needs to be geared a tad higher at the sprocket (less teeth) to match the same overall drive ratio that a Hawk or other 18" rear wheel has.

Thus, a 42 or 43 rear sprocket on the 17" rear wheel and a 45 on the 18" wheel end up at the same overall drive ratio.

The 17/45 combination is extremely popular on the Hawks for a good reason. It's a great combination for bikes that see road use that also doesn't entirely kill power for light off road trail riding.

Nospark · 02-22-2022, 07:26 PM

Well I got my 17 tooth sprocket on the front and as feared, the chain is too short keeping the stock 46 tooth rear. I'm going to go ahead and install the 42 tooth rear. It's an excuse to check rear axle and bearings. I also bought upgraded sprocket studs. I'll install those while I'm in this deep.
I'm perplexed now by trying to adjust the clutch cable but, that's a topic for a different thread.

02-14-2022, 09:42 AM	#1
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	Chains I've been trying to understand all the info in here about chains. My new TBR showed up and I'm doing my best to follow Magadan's resource guide for the Hawk 250. I don't want to spend a lot of $ on upgrades out of the gate but, do want to make use of the bike arriving largely disassembled for upgrades that I know I'll want like, carb jetting and front sprocket. I had flight time for a work trip. Since there's no way you're gonna get a lap top open on a flight in coach anymore, I read the TBR7 owners manual cover to cover out of boredom. I was surprised it talked about the bike having an o-ring chain. I understood this type to be an upgrade over non-O-ring? In any event, my question is..... If it is in fact an O-ring chain, is it still a good practice to remove it and soak it in heavy gear oil?
	0

02-14-2022, 12:46 PM	#2
Ol,fart Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Gatesville Texas Posts: 161	Yes. I use bar oil for chainsaws, its sticky and stays in the chain longer. O-ring chains are good for dirt because the o rings keep dirt out but its also harder to get the oil in. Move the links around alot while it is soaking. __________________ 2021 RPS Hawk "IKEA" (Came in a box with no instructions) 110 main jet 1washer,2.5 sprockets and the cat fell off( with a little help) 1984 Honda V65 Magna "Daddy's Little Monster" To whoever stole my anti-depressants. I Hope Your Happy !
	0

02-14-2022, 02:53 PM	#4
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 8,051	O-ring chains don't need oil to get inside the O-ring. The O rings seal in the grease that the factory puts on the chain. The O-rings themselves can do with a little lubrication just to keep them from drying out and tearing from friction, but it doesn't take very much. I clean my O-ring chain and then use a dry lubricant and/or chain wax that is intended for o-ring chains. It's not as sticky as gear oil so it doesn't attract as much dirt. For standard chains, yes the gear oil bath is a great idea. Or, a hot grease or paraffin wax bath. Since the rollers don't have lubrication sealed in with O-rings it is much more important that the lubricant gets into the rollers. __________________ Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 2024 Royal Enfield Shotgun 650 https://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=34124 Last edited by Megadan; 02-15-2022 at 02:30 AM.
	2

02-15-2022, 09:35 AM	#10
TxTaoRider Join Date: Oct 2020 Location: Flower Mound Texas Posts: 904	My tbr7 came with a pretty gold chain, but it wasn't an o ring style. __________________ 2021 Tao Tbr7 - "Lucille" Mods so far- Brozz swingarm, 21" front rim (Bridgestone Tw302 rear/Dunlop D606 front tires), Digital gauge cluster, pz30b pumper carb, after market hand guards, aftermarket brake and clutch levers, round fold away mirrors, Fly handlebars shortened slightly, 13t front sprocket 2009 Q-link Legacy 250 1982 Suzuki GS1100ES - "Jolene"
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02-14-2022, 01:48 PM	#3
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	I happen to have some bar oil. I'll take your advice. Thx
	0

02-14-2022, 08:12 PM	#5
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	Magadan, can you share specifics on the dry lube and chain wax brands you're using. I don't have either so, I might as well get what you're having good results with.
	0

02-14-2022, 08:26 PM	#7
KSSK Join Date: Oct 2021 Posts: 99	I'm surprised to hear the TBR7 comes with a sealed chain. My more expensive Lifan X-Pect came with a plain chain. I just installed a JT x-ring chain that was $40. Have you looked to confirm it really is sealed?
	0

02-15-2022, 06:04 AM	#8
Mudflap Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,894	I run my Oring chains dry except for a tiny amount of gear oil on the Orings every couple thousand miles to keep them from cracking. A dry chain doesn't attract dirt and grit that wear out the rollers and sprockets.
	0

02-15-2022, 06:36 AM	#9
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	As far as it coming with an O-ring chain, I am just going by what the manual says at this point. I will look at some pics on the web, educate myself what the two types look like, then confirm which is actually on the bike. It's certainly possible the manual could indicate O-ring when there isn't one on the bike. Out of town this week so will do that Sat.
	0

02-22-2022, 10:33 AM	#11
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	I have to conclude the TBR7 manual that came with the bike is incorrect. The bike did not come with an O-ring chain. I have a chain length problem. I went to replace the front sprocket and learned I bought a nice new 15 tooth to swap out a nice new 15 tooth. Didn't seem like much of a difference so I ordered the 17 tooth I intended to buy the first time. I'm almost certain my new chain that came with the bike is not going to be long enough to use a 17 tooth front sprocket. The chain adjusters were already maxed out with the 15 tooth and of course were adjusted way too tight as delivered. If I go with the 17 tooth front, I'll have a chain project. I wanted to try just the 17 tooth front and see if I wanted to swap rear later. Now I'm thinking If I swap the rear from the 46 as delivered to the 42 I bought, the stock chain will likely fit. Will I be happy with that gearing?
	0

02-22-2022, 11:01 AM	#12
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	The stamping on the stock chain is "CHOHO 428H" I'm pretty sure that's super high end professional racing grade and length. I'm ignorant about chains. Is 426 the number of lengths? What is the "H" designation?
	0

02-22-2022, 11:13 AM	#13
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	OK, Got the chain thing figured out, Chain size 428 which dictates pitch and inner width. Nothing to do with # of links. Back to my question on gearing... I believe others are running 17 front & 42 rear on TBR7's which is why I ordered these sprocket sizes. Can anyone comment on 1st hand experience with this combo?
	0

02-22-2022, 07:26 PM	#15
Nospark Join Date: Jan 2022 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 167	Well I got my 17 tooth sprocket on the front and as feared, the chain is too short keeping the stock 46 tooth rear. I'm going to go ahead and install the 42 tooth rear. It's an excuse to check rear axle and bearings. I also bought upgraded sprocket studs. I'll install those while I'm in this deep. I'm perplexed now by trying to adjust the clutch cable but, that's a topic for a different thread.
	0