Johnny Pag?

[panterra_rider]

it's been a long time for me on this board...glad to see it's still around!

Don't know how I came across them but have been trying to find out about the Johnny Pag motorcycles. Dealerships have popped up around Canada now and I have to say that the FX-3 naked bike really really looks interesting to me. Hits a "sweet spot" for what I like in bikes...


http://www.johnnypag.ca/motorcycles/sport/index.asp

I've had a coupla Chinese dirtbikes...we're going into our 4th summer with them and they still work great. I'm just not sure I want to take one onto the street...different ballgame in my opinion.

But seems like the guy behind these products is really committed. And he's putting out stuff that people want. Anyone else hear about these? Are we seeing a different model for china bike marketing here?

I'm trying hard not to go see one in person since I think I might walk out with a paid invoice...lol.

Cheers,
Rian

[forchetto]

They're often sold under the Regal Raptor brand name. They're well made and with a superb finish. There's a thread here started a few days ago, discussing them:

http://www.mychinamoto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29

[SpudRider]

Originally Posted by panterra_rider

it's been a long time for me on this board...glad to see it's still around!

Don't know how I came across them but have been trying to find out about the Johnny Pag motorcycles. Dealerships have popped up around Canada now and I have to say that the FX-3 naked bike really really looks interesting to me. Hits a "sweet spot" for what I like in bikes...


http://www.johnnypag.ca/motorcycles/sport/index.asp

...I'm trying hard not to go see one in person since I think I might walk out with a paid invoice...lol.

Cheers,
Rian

Welcome back, Rian! Thank you for letting us know about the Johnny Pag FX3!



That is a sweet looking motorcycle! I found some Johnny Pag dealerships fairly close by in Utah; I just might go take a test ride on this puppy! If I ride it, I will certainly post my impressions.

Spud

[SpeedSouth]

I looked at these last year at my local dealer, but didn't get to take it for a ride.

My overall impression was that it's a typical China bike. The 'fit & finish' was better than the cheaper Chinese brands, but not up to the Japanese quality. The quality of the parts and materials appeared to be about the same - better than other Chinese stuff, but not top shelf.

And even though I didn't get to ride one, I suspect the power is lacking as compared to the Ninja 250 (based on specs and comments from the salesman); which is bad news for a 300cc bike w/ a MSRP only $500 less than the Ninja 250.


I really want to like these bikes, I just find it hard to justify the price when compared to the Kaw. :(


That is my opinion. You may find otherwise.

[forchetto]

Originally Posted by SpeedSouth

I really want to like these bikes, I just find it hard to justify the price when compared to the Kaw. :(

I agree with you. Chinese bike importers seem to be oblivious to the fact that Japan is not going to stand still and hand over their markets to them.
Witness the damage the new Indian asembled, fuel injected Honda CBF125 is doing to the Chinese market, it's only a few dollars more than a comparable Chinese bike and far, far superior in performance durability, warranty, service, long term spares, etc. They are selling like hot cakes in Europe.

I suppose Honda is making very little profit on each one, whereas Chinese importers in Europe usually sell their bikes for something like 3 times what they cost to import. I don't know if it's the same everywhere, but here the bikes have to come with a copy of the import, shipping and Customs documents to be able to register them. In these documents you can see details of what the shipping involved, for example it may give details of container sizes and contents. If you do the sums, you can work out the cost per bike, including import charges, etc.

As most importers spend something like 0.10 cents on pre-delivery inspection and virtually nothing in providing an after sales structure and spares stocking, supporting sports, or sometimes even decent premises. A lot just rent an old industrial unit and sell on the internet, you can see how profitable they can be.

If you want, you can go to sites like alibaba.com or madeinchina.com, find a bike exporter of the sort that quotes how many of the things fit into a container, etc, and pretend you're a potential importer, asking them for a price. You'll be amazed by the total cost per bike. Small scooters can be bought for $250-300, in bulk.

[SpudRider]

Originally Posted by SpeedSouth

...I really want to like these bikes, I just find it hard to justify the price when compared to the Kaw. :(

That is my opinion. You may find otherwise.

Yes, I agree. This motorcycle is definitely overpriced when compared to the Kawasaki Ninja 250R.

Originally Posted by forchetto

...As most importers spend something like 0.10 cents on pre-delivery inspection and virtually nothing in providing an after sales structure and spares stocking, supporting sports, or sometimes even decent premises. A lot just rent an old industrial unit and sell on the internet, you can see how profitable they can be...

Indeed, it seems that most of the Chinese motorcycle importers are getting quite greedy. If you shop carefully, you can still find an occasional bargain. However, I am constantly amazed how so many Chinese motorcycle dealers have raised their prices so high relative to the Japanese bikes. :roll:

Spud

[panterra_rider]

problem is Kawi' or Honda won't put those sweet lower CC motors into a naked cruiser style bike, like this FX-3 - I just don't want a sportbike-ish deal like the Honda CB or Kawi' Ninja - if I did, I'd get a used 600 from one of the big Four. [sigh] just like with cars it sucks to be in North America :roll:

Thanks for the info. and discussion, guys - I agree, it's probably a little overpriced - maybe around $3000 taxes and PDI all in and we'd all take a closer look.

Cheers,
R.

[SpudRider]

Originally Posted by panterra_rider

problem is Kawi' or Honda won't put those sweet lower CC motors into a naked cruiser style bike, like this FX-3 - I just don't want a sportbike-ish deal like the Honda CB or Kawi' Ninja - if I did, I'd get a used 600 from one of the big Four. [sigh] just like with cars it sucks to be in North America :roll:

Thanks for the info. and discussion, guys - I agree, it's probably a little overpriced - maybe around $3000 taxes and PDI all in and we'd all take a closer look.

Cheers,
R.

Have you considered the Hyosung Comet GT250 / United Motors V2S 250?

http://www.hyosungmotorsusa.com/prod...se&model=GT250

http://www.umamerica.com/site/usa/mo...ml#usa_motost1





These are very nice "naked" sport bikes, with an upright seating posture. Both of these motorcycles are made by Hyosung, in Korea. The MSRP for the Hyosung Comet GT250 is $3,499 USD (U.S. Dollars), just $100 USD more than the Johnny Pag FX3!

P.S. I would still enjoy test riding the FX3. If I do ride it, I will post my impressions here.

Spud

[panterra_rider]

there is a Hyosung dealership here and I might take a look...would be nice if they had something between 250 and 650.

R.

[dsrt4]

I would take that hyosung over a JP any day!

The gt250's are very nice bikes!

[Dragon]

When comparing japan bike to china bike, sometimes people take their impression of 600cc, $7000 sport bike from japan and judge china bike. Obviously, china bike will never compare well that way. I had a 250cc Honda CB250 Nighthawk, and it really isn't that much better than a Lifan LF250B. This economy price Honda looks cheap, the seat was crooked, the plastic cracked just like china bike's, and the weld looks slobber. The Honda vibrated like crazy at 70 mph; the mirrors were just a blur at high speed, just like china bike's. I haven't even mention the piston-ring failure on the Honda after only 3000 miles.

[SpeedSouth]

United Motors has a naked 250 -
http://www.umamerica.com/site/usa/mo...ml#usa_motost1

Only $3899 :P

[SpeedSouth]

Originally Posted by Dragon

When comparing japan bike to china bike, sometimes people take their impression of 600cc, $7000 sport bike from japan and judge china bike. Obviously, china bike will never compare well that way.

I didn't see anyone mention a 600cc / $7000 machine, but that aside, how else does one "compare"?

You look at both machines and see the differences. And I personally see no differences in the fit and finish, or material quality, when comparing a Kawasaki 250 with a ZX14, for example. The controls feel the same on all the Kaw machines, for the most part (cruisers, sport, dirt are slightly diff from each other, but all quality).

There are differences between all manufatures, and there are more obvious differences in the feel of quality between the Chinese bikes that I've looked at, and the Japanese bikes. It's no secret that the Chinese versions have lower quality platics and metal, and there's nothing wrong with that, as it's why they are generally easier to afford (cheaper) than a Japanese bike.

When the discussion turns to a bike that costs about the same as slightly higher quality bike, then it's only fair to point it out, IMO.

I was very seriously considering a Pag, and I think perhaps the extra cost is offset by the personal service that Johnny Pag Jr. has gained a reputation for providing after the sale. I've read accounts of customers talking to Jr directly, which just doesn't happen with other brands. But make no mistake about it, he is selling a Chinese built machine.

I'm not trying to knock the Pag bikes, or any China bike, but I see no point in dancing around the obvious. 8)

[Qingdao]

Originally Posted by Dragon

... I had a 250cc Honda CB250 Nighthawk, and it really isn't that much better than a Lifan LF250B...

Sounds like the CMX needed tunning. I never ridden a 250b, but if it is simmialr to my 200 then the honda should be hella faster. I sold (and souped) my old Rebel 250 and that thing would get up and move like it had a stick in its @$$.

[SpudRider]

Originally Posted by panterra_rider

there is a Hyosung dealership here and I might take a look...would be nice if they had something between 250 and 650.

R.

As I noted, you might also want to check out the UM V2S 250. However, the Hyosung bikes are less expensive than the UM bikes. Also, until the end of May, Hyosung America is offering either a $350 or a $300 rebate on the GT250 (I would post the link, but the Hyosung website is currently offline). In Canada, you can get a $250 rebate for completing a motorcycle training course. These rebates make the Hyosung less expensive than the JP FX3.

http://www.nationalmotorsports.ca/blank_4.html

If you test ride the Hyosung, please post your impressions.

P.S. Hyosung America is also offering a $500 rebate on the GT650 Comet.

Spud