KTM 200 Duke

TheRealWorld · 12-13-2020, 10:05 PM

Today I got an email rating best bikes and the KTM 200 Duke ranked first in its class. So I was wondering if any of you have an opinion on it. I kind of wonder if it is a cloned or if there is a clone of it?

2LZ · 12-13-2020, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealWorld

Today I got an email rating best bikes and the KTM 200 Duke ranked first in its class. So I was wondering if any of you have an opinion on it. I kind of wonder if it is a cloned or if there is a clone of it?

I didn't even know they made a 200 Duke. I bet it's awesome though. I'm currently looking at the 390 Duke. Is it made in India like the 390????

culcune · 12-13-2020, 10:37 PM

Have not really seen one to form an opinion. I believe they are made in India by the joint venture between KTM and Bajaj. I know the Duke 390 is made in India, so that is why I am guessing the 200 is made there as well (i.e. companies usually make certain sized engines and below at the same factory).

I think if I was looking for a small-displacement bike in the 200cc range, I would certainly look at the Chinese bikes simply for cost saving, namely the Lifan range. The Lifan KPM 200 to be exact would be my main choice out of 200cc street bikes. As far as dollar for dollar, however, the Benelli TNT300 has the same MSRP as the baby Duke but has 32 hp (vs. 26 for the KTM), and for $400 more, the Benelli 302S has 37 hp.

That being said, in the minimalist class of small-displacement street bikes, the KTM looks like a fun bike. I have not seen any clones of it, so to find something similar in idea, one would have to look at the Chinese bikes I mentioned above.

TheRealWorld · 12-13-2020, 10:54 PM

Great replies! So Calcune, I like your thoughts, and would like your input on what might be the best Chinese bike in the 200 to 250 size, available as of today? I have an idea what you will say, but I am talking specifically if you feel you can be that specific. I have had three Chinese bikes and liked them all, and that was when they were a bit less reliable than today.

culcune · 12-13-2020, 11:50 PM

What is your budget and what kind of riding? You are probably familiar with the dual-sports, and not much has changed, although there are now two that come with fuel-injection; the Hawk DLX 250 and the Lifan X-Pect 200. Then, moving into street bikes, there are three Lifans to consider; the KP200 (stylish standard-ish bike) and KPR200 (sportbike) use the same liquid-cooled/fuel-injected engines and utilize a 6-speed transmission. Way down on power as compared to the KTM (rated at 17 hp). The third one is a styling hit in my opinion, the KPM200. Its engine is nearly identical to the KP/KPR200's but is apparently slightly different and improved (at least when the KPM entered the market). I am guessing all 3 Lifans now utilize the same, improved 200. Personally, I would buy the KPM200 out of the 3 based on the styling. Now, moving up in price, there is the Zongshen RX3 sold via CSC; the bike that arguably started the small-displacement adventure bike category. Obviously, with the right tires, this bike can be ridden on dirt roads and light trails, as well as the street. Pricier, too, as compared to the Lifans, but much more versatile and it comes with a heck of a lot of storage with its stock panniers and luggage set (some people feel the stock luggage is cheap, and CSC offers upgraded heavy-duty luggage, but the fact that you get it stock is a good deal in my opinion). I have not heard of too many negatives with the RX3 in its several year run (I believe 2015 or maybe 2014?) so it has that bit of longevity piece of mind built in). The Bennelli bikes are made in China, but headquartered in Italy, and from all the YouTube reviews of the bikes, they seem to be the real deal. Bennelli are distributed by SSR Motorsports, and SSR offers the Buccaneer 250 which has a cult following around the world (it is made by Italjet--in China, where else?

) and seems to be a fun, sporty bike for the money. It utilizes a Lifan-sourced engine, the same engine as found in the Lifan Lycan 250 cruiser bike which seems to be a good bike for the money in the budget cruiser class of bikes. I am sure others will have bikes I have forgotten to mention, but other than the myriad of dual-sports, I think I have covered the 200cc+ class of Chinese bikes.

Wild Dog · 12-13-2020, 11:56 PM

It is made by Bajaj in India and is quite popular in South America as is the Duke 390.
It’s a bit more expensive than a Rouser 200 but a bit cheaper than a similar Honda or Yamaha.
I find it odd that KTM is willing to sell that bike in the US where 500cc is seen as “tiny”

TheRealWorld · 12-14-2020, 12:58 AM

Again, lots of good info, and exactly what I was looking for. Thanks for all your great advice and your perspective.

Wild Dog · 12-14-2020, 08:27 AM

Top Speed for the older model

They made some change i think in 2018.

It's about 300 usd cheaper than a similar Honda or Yamaha

Quote:

Originally Posted by culcune

I think if I was looking for a small-displacement bike in the 200cc range, I would certainly look at the Chinese bikes simply for cost saving, namely the Lifan range. The Lifan KPM 200 to be exact would be my main choice out of 200cc street bikes. As far as dollar for dollar, however, the Benelli TNT300 has the same MSRP as the baby Duke but has 32 hp (vs. 26 for the KTM), and for $400 more, the Benelli 302S has 37 hp.

.

i would advise against the Benelli. I have a friend who had a lot issue with them, even one who had a replacement engine with less than 10.000 km.

KTM is just in another league even if it has a few less HP, better build both Bajaj and KTM are more known than "BENELLI ITALIAN BRAND!!! but made in China"

The friend with the replacement engine went from a Dominar 400 to a TNT 300 because "Hey it says italian brand, is not indian like the dominar plus it has 2 cylinders!!"...
He is still crying after he had to pay for the replacement engine....

culcune · 12-14-2020, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wild Dog

Top Speed for the older model

They made some change i think in 2018.

It's about 300 usd cheaper than a similar Honda or Yamaha

i would advise against the Benelli. I have a friend who had a lot issue with them, even one who had a replacement engine with less than 10.000 km.

KTM is just in another league even if it has a few less HP, better build both Bajaj and KTM are more known than "BENELLI ITALIAN BRAND!!! but made in China"

The friend with the replacement engine went from a Dominar 400 to a TNT 300 because "Hey it says italian brand, is not indian like the dominar plus it has 2 cylinders!!"...
He is still crying after he had to pay for the replacement engine....

That's good to know. We haven't seen anyone on here with a Benelli other than the TNT135 which seems like a good bike for the GLV class, and one member, Chopper Charles, who was seriously considering the 302S, but ended up having a used RX3 more recently find its way to his garage.

I am with you on asking why they would bring the 200 to the US although the video showing an older model riding at or near 100 mph is northing to sneeze at, either; I know it has a decent claimed horsepower, so at least a beginner wouldn't get tired of the bike soon after feeling comfortable riding the little beast, but I still think the best bikes for learning on are Chinese bikes simply because of the low cost of entry means less 'pain' for the owner whenever the bike is dropped--it WILL be dropped at some point, and maybe multiple times, and most of us would rather drop a $2500 bike than a $4000 bike. After mastering the (now beat up Lifan :lol), one could upgrade to a KTM 390, or even get into one of the 400 or 500cc class bikes offered by the Japanese brands (i.e. CB500 series; Z400, Ninja 400).

Wild Dog · 12-14-2020, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by culcune

That's good to know. We haven't seen anyone on here with a Benelli other than the TNT135 which seems like a good bike for the GLV class, and one member, Chopper Charles, who was seriously considering the 302S, but ended up having a used RX3 more recently find its way to his garage.

I have a big distaste for Benellis, due the fact they try to hard to hide their origin and i don't trust someone who hides their origin.

For example
Hero Motocorp, they are proud to be an indian company even in some models they put "The Best selling motorcycle on India".
Cfmoto the same, Lifan the same...

But here it is "ITALIAN BRAND" and a Italy flags everywhere...

10.000 km every single service done on Benelli dealership.

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ChopperCharles · 12-14-2020, 01:11 PM

Lotus and Volvo are owned by the Chinese, but they don't go advertising that fact. Benelli has a lot of history. Yes they're currently Chinese owned, but they don't appear to be hiding that fact. They're just not advertising it, which makes sense, but every motorcycle magazine and review out there points this out, so it's not being hidden. It's far less common to know that Volvo is Chinese, I think.

Charles.

culcune · 12-14-2020, 01:48 PM

ChopperCharles--thanks for chiming in and updating your thread

TheRealWorld--you might want to check out ChopperCharles' thread on his Buccaneer 250. I had mentioned it, but you can get first hand knowledge of one:

http://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=17743

12-13-2020, 10:05 PM	#1
TheRealWorld Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 817	KTM 200 Duke Today I got an email rating best bikes and the KTM 200 Duke ranked first in its class. So I was wondering if any of you have an opinion on it. I kind of wonder if it is a cloned or if there is a clone of it?
	1

12-13-2020, 10:37 PM	#3
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,035	Have not really seen one to form an opinion. I believe they are made in India by the joint venture between KTM and Bajaj. I know the Duke 390 is made in India, so that is why I am guessing the 200 is made there as well (i.e. companies usually make certain sized engines and below at the same factory). I think if I was looking for a small-displacement bike in the 200cc range, I would certainly look at the Chinese bikes simply for cost saving, namely the Lifan range. The Lifan KPM 200 to be exact would be my main choice out of 200cc street bikes. As far as dollar for dollar, however, the Benelli TNT300 has the same MSRP as the baby Duke but has 32 hp (vs. 26 for the KTM), and for $400 more, the Benelli 302S has 37 hp. That being said, in the minimalist class of small-displacement street bikes, the KTM looks like a fun bike. I have not seen any clones of it, so to find something similar in idea, one would have to look at the Chinese bikes I mentioned above. __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
	0

12-13-2020, 11:50 PM	#5
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,035	What is your budget and what kind of riding? You are probably familiar with the dual-sports, and not much has changed, although there are now two that come with fuel-injection; the Hawk DLX 250 and the Lifan X-Pect 200. Then, moving into street bikes, there are three Lifans to consider; the KP200 (stylish standard-ish bike) and KPR200 (sportbike) use the same liquid-cooled/fuel-injected engines and utilize a 6-speed transmission. Way down on power as compared to the KTM (rated at 17 hp). The third one is a styling hit in my opinion, the KPM200. Its engine is nearly identical to the KP/KPR200's but is apparently slightly different and improved (at least when the KPM entered the market). I am guessing all 3 Lifans now utilize the same, improved 200. Personally, I would buy the KPM200 out of the 3 based on the styling. Now, moving up in price, there is the Zongshen RX3 sold via CSC; the bike that arguably started the small-displacement adventure bike category. Obviously, with the right tires, this bike can be ridden on dirt roads and light trails, as well as the street. Pricier, too, as compared to the Lifans, but much more versatile and it comes with a heck of a lot of storage with its stock panniers and luggage set (some people feel the stock luggage is cheap, and CSC offers upgraded heavy-duty luggage, but the fact that you get it stock is a good deal in my opinion). I have not heard of too many negatives with the RX3 in its several year run (I believe 2015 or maybe 2014?) so it has that bit of longevity piece of mind built in). The Bennelli bikes are made in China, but headquartered in Italy, and from all the YouTube reviews of the bikes, they seem to be the real deal. Bennelli are distributed by SSR Motorsports, and SSR offers the Buccaneer 250 which has a cult following around the world (it is made by Italjet--in China, where else? ) and seems to be a fun, sporty bike for the money. It utilizes a Lifan-sourced engine, the same engine as found in the Lifan Lycan 250 cruiser bike which seems to be a good bike for the money in the budget cruiser class of bikes. I am sure others will have bikes I have forgotten to mention, but other than the myriad of dual-sports, I think I have covered the 200cc+ class of Chinese bikes. __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
	0

12-14-2020, 01:48 PM	#12
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,035	ChopperCharles--thanks for chiming in and updating your thread TheRealWorld--you might want to check out ChopperCharles' thread on his Buccaneer 250. I had mentioned it, but you can get first hand knowledge of one: http://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=17743 __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
	0

12-13-2020, 10:54 PM	#4
TheRealWorld Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 817	Great replies! So Calcune, I like your thoughts, and would like your input on what might be the best Chinese bike in the 200 to 250 size, available as of today? I have an idea what you will say, but I am talking specifically if you feel you can be that specific. I have had three Chinese bikes and liked them all, and that was when they were a bit less reliable than today.
	1

12-13-2020, 11:56 PM	#6
Wild Dog Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: Argentina Posts: 756	It is made by Bajaj in India and is quite popular in South America as is the Duke 390. It’s a bit more expensive than a Rouser 200 but a bit cheaper than a similar Honda or Yamaha. I find it odd that KTM is willing to sell that bike in the US where 500cc is seen as “tiny”
	0

12-14-2020, 12:58 AM	#7
TheRealWorld Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 817	Again, lots of good info, and exactly what I was looking for. Thanks for all your great advice and your perspective.
	0

12-14-2020, 01:11 PM	#11
ChopperCharles Join Date: Feb 2018 Location: RDU, NC Posts: 677	Lotus and Volvo are owned by the Chinese, but they don't go advertising that fact. Benelli has a lot of history. Yes they're currently Chinese owned, but they don't appear to be hiding that fact. They're just not advertising it, which makes sense, but every motorcycle magazine and review out there points this out, so it's not being hidden. It's far less common to know that Volvo is Chinese, I think. Charles.
	1