Downshifting Hawk 250 Use Clutch?

Bud1968 · 10-21-2018, 10:21 PM

Probably a dumb question but I always used my clutch to downshift in the past when I rode a 2 stroke 3 wheeler or four wheeler and was reading where on a four stroke it's not necessary to use clutch for downshifting so that's new to me was just wondering if that's true.

timcosby · 10-21-2018, 11:06 PM

downshifting without clutch is harder than upshifting without using clutch. to downshift without clutch put a tiny bit of pressure on shifter and when bike is slow enough it will easily go down a gear. upshifting is done by just flicking the throttle off and shifting. works in cars to with synchronized gears. two stroke four stroke shouldnt matter

DualSport · 10-22-2018, 04:16 AM

I've always just brought rev up and went in to the gear that can handle that moving-speed without hurting the engine.. If I even use engine braking..

Floating gears shifting is probably a bad idea on an engine and transmission that already has durability issues..

roundhouse · 10-22-2018, 07:14 AM

I would use the clutch on these bikes.

**JerryHawk250** · 10-22-2018, 07:49 AM

I've upshift without the clutch while cruising but not at WOT. Not saying it can't be done but I personally wouldn't down shifting without a clutch. If you can down shift it without having to force it and it does it smoothly it shouldn't be an issue.

ricardoguitars · 10-22-2018, 12:33 PM

Use the clutch, clutchless shifting puts unnecessary stress on the gearbox, it is also a good idea to match the revs when downshifting to reduce the stress.

Megadan · 10-22-2018, 01:15 PM

You can both up and downshift without using the clutch, but it is not recommended. Like any dog style gearbox, it is possible without using a clutch, but it is very hard on the dogs causing a lot of wear and stress that can lead to broken dog teeth. The downshifting takes that and adds the very real risk of shock damage to the gear teeth and shafts along with the very real risk of the rear tire breaking traction if done at higher RPM

With all of that said, while in motion it is very easy to shift without pulling the clutch lever all the way in. Especially on upshifts, I often only use one or two fingers to just barely engage the clutch between gears.

The gear spacing on these bikes is fairly wide, so speed shifting is somewhat pointless. Combine that with the fact that the gears and shafts in these motors are made to a low price point, meaning they are not that strong to begin with, and you run the risk of creating a very bad day for yourself.

Ariel Red Hunter · 10-22-2018, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bud1968

Probably a dumb question but I always used my clutch to downshift in the past when I rode a 2 stroke 3 wheeler or four wheeler and was reading where on a four stroke it's not necessary to use clutch for downshifting so that's new to me was just wondering if that's true.

I've only done that when coming to a stop. And then only occasionally. Most of my bikes were 4 speeders. So, 4th to third at about 2500 rpm, 3rd to second, 2000, 2nd to almost an idle, then into first or neutral. I partially pulled the clutch for all of the shifts, just to take the shock on the dogs (the gears are actually put in and out of mesh by dog clutches) off a little. Shifting up, if I was in a hurry, I would rest my foot on the shift lever, "touch" the clutch lever, and bingo a fast upshift. When another upshift became desireable, I'd go through the same routine again. Now those transmissions were all 1 up, 3 down rigs with really superb shifting mechanisms. I have never shifted a 1 down 3 or 4 up transmission as smoothly as the earlier ones. So my advice is at least partially pull the clutch every time you are in a hurry. And pull the clutch all of the way when you are not in a hurry. Your transmission will appreciate it..ARH

Bud1968 · 10-22-2018, 08:59 PM

Thanks for the advice, I'll keep on using the clutch. The bikes been running good don't wanna cause extra stress on it.

10-21-2018, 10:21 PM	#1
Bud1968 Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Michigan Posts: 40	Downshifting Hawk 250 Use Clutch? Probably a dumb question but I always used my clutch to downshift in the past when I rode a 2 stroke 3 wheeler or four wheeler and was reading where on a four stroke it's not necessary to use clutch for downshifting so that's new to me was just wondering if that's true.
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10-21-2018, 11:06 PM	#2
timcosby Join Date: Nov 2016 Location: robertsdale alabama usa Posts: 1,007	downshifting without clutch is harder than upshifting without using clutch. to downshift without clutch put a tiny bit of pressure on shifter and when bike is slow enough it will easily go down a gear. upshifting is done by just flicking the throttle off and shifting. works in cars to with synchronized gears. two stroke four stroke shouldnt matter __________________ 1991 harley heritage softail classic 2016 hawk kaw h1 400 tripple 13' long chopper in progress 2009 johnny pag bar hog 2004 hd electra glide ultra classic shriner edition 1997 harley davidson 1200 sportster 1972 harley davidson amf sx250
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10-22-2018, 07:49 AM	#5
JerryHawk250 Moderator Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Houma, La. Posts: 11,588	I've upshift without the clutch while cruising but not at WOT. Not saying it can't be done but I personally wouldn't down shifting without a clutch. If you can down shift it without having to force it and it does it smoothly it shouldn't be an issue. __________________ 2023 Lifan Lycan 250 Chopper 2023 Venom Evader 2022 Lifan KPX250 2020 Kawasaki Vulcan S (Sold) 2004 Honda ST 1300 2016 Black Hawk 250 (sold) Keihin PE30 carb,125 main,38 slow.Pod filter,ported & decked head 10:1 CR,Direct Ignition Coil,15/40Sprockets,NGK DPR8EIX-9,De-Cat,Dual Oil Cooler,Digital Cluster 2016 Cazador180 XL 2014 Coolster150 JerryHawk250.com My YouTube Channel
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10-22-2018, 01:15 PM	#7
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 8,055	You can both up and downshift without using the clutch, but it is not recommended. Like any dog style gearbox, it is possible without using a clutch, but it is very hard on the dogs causing a lot of wear and stress that can lead to broken dog teeth. The downshifting takes that and adds the very real risk of shock damage to the gear teeth and shafts along with the very real risk of the rear tire breaking traction if done at higher RPM With all of that said, while in motion it is very easy to shift without pulling the clutch lever all the way in. Especially on upshifts, I often only use one or two fingers to just barely engage the clutch between gears. The gear spacing on these bikes is fairly wide, so speed shifting is somewhat pointless. Combine that with the fact that the gears and shafts in these motors are made to a low price point, meaning they are not that strong to begin with, and you run the risk of creating a very bad day for yourself. __________________ Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 2024 Royal Enfield Shotgun 650 https://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=34124
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10-22-2018, 04:16 AM	#3
DualSport Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 173	I've always just brought rev up and went in to the gear that can handle that moving-speed without hurting the engine.. If I even use engine braking.. Floating gears shifting is probably a bad idea on an engine and transmission that already has durability issues..
	1

10-22-2018, 07:14 AM	#4
roundhouse Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: N Texas Posts: 706	I would use the clutch on these bikes.
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10-22-2018, 12:33 PM	#6
ricardoguitars Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Costa Rica Posts: 82	Use the clutch, clutchless shifting puts unnecessary stress on the gearbox, it is also a good idea to match the revs when downshifting to reduce the stress.
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10-22-2018, 08:59 PM	#9
Bud1968 Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Michigan Posts: 40	Thanks for the advice, I'll keep on using the clutch. The bikes been running good don't wanna cause extra stress on it.
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