ZS190 Swapped Grom Clone capabilities?

SirKng · 04-07-2020, 03:36 PM

So I'd like to know if a ZS190 swapped Grom clone can handle my commute. I live on a 55 MPH state highway with a slight hill at one point and it goes like that for 2-3 miles then it hits residential roads then back to a short stretch of 50 MPH highway. What do you all think? Yes? Or should I look for a bigger bike?

I'm not really opposed to buying a brand new clone and swapping the engine before even riding it if this setup will work for my commute.

kirbo7106 · 04-07-2020, 05:36 PM

From a mechanical aspect, the 190 will get you there. From what I understand, the 190 will get you to 70 plus. The real question is, do YOU want to go that fast on 12 inch rims.

Tell us about that stretch of road. Is it a 2 lane Or a four lane. On a 2 lane, I wouldn’t worry too much. On a four lane, cars are going to be traveling at 65-70 mph and they will pass you!

If you check out YouTube, there are several people that ride on major roads with a Lifan KP 150 Mini Or a clone with a 190.

If I were planning on riding a clone with a 190, I would have a few mods that I deem necessary! Brakes! I would get the big brake kit with stainless steel braided brake lines. Tires! Michelin has some nice tires. Lights! Definitely an LED headlight. As cool as the integrated turn signals are, I would go with these:
Name: AB06B80A-E82B-4C82-96E7-271C23D578DB.jpg
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Name: AB06B80A-E82B-4C82-96E7-271C23D578DB.jpg
Views: 3399
Size: 4.2 KB

They are on Amazon, look for BSK. They cost $45. MegaDan, and others, have them on their Hawk 250s and I have them on my HellCat. I’ve also seen a brake light that goes around your license plate. Not necessary, but still consider it.

Keep us posted!

wheelbender6 · 04-07-2020, 05:42 PM

The Kymco K-Pipe, or a Chinese made equivalent may work better for a 190cc swap. The taller tires will feel more stable at highway speeds, as mentioned above.

franque · 04-07-2020, 06:17 PM

It's up to you (and depends on your size, a little bit). With a Grom clone, you're basically going to the max of the intended performance envelope. If you were to get, say, a TBR7, you'll already have a more powerful motor, you'll be more geometrically stable, due to the bigger wheels/longer wheelbase, and you'll be able to venture rather afield than just 55mph zones.

Even with the swap, while the Grom clone might have the thrust to go faster, I'd imagine it'll start to feel unstable at speeds above ~60.

SirKng · 04-07-2020, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kirbo7106

From a mechanical aspect, the 190 will get you there. From what I understand, the 190 will get you to 70 plus. The real question is, do YOU want to go that fast on 12 inch rims.

Tell us about that stretch of road. Is it a 2 lane Or a four lane. On a 2 lane, I wouldn’t worry too much. On a four lane, cars are going to be traveling at 65-70 mph and they will pass you!

If you check out YouTube, there are several people that ride on major roads with a Lifan KP 150 Mini Or a clone with a 190.

If I were planning on riding a clone with a 190, I would have a few mods that I deem necessary! Brakes! I would get the big brake kit with stainless steel braided brake lines. Tires! Michelin has some nice tires. Lights! Definitely an LED headlight. As cool as the integrated turn signals are, I would go with these:
Attachment 20819
They are on Amazon, look for BSK. They cost $45. MegaDan, and others, have them on their Hawk 250s and I have them on my HellCat. I’ve also seen a brake light that goes around your license plate. Not necessary, but still consider it.

Keep us posted!

It's just a two lane highway. I just want to be able to do 55-60 with power to climb the hill and pass if I need to. I'll also keep in mind about the mods to make it safer.

What about a steering stabilizer? Will that help the bike be more stable at higher speed?

And I'll look into the Lifan bike too.

SirKng · 04-07-2020, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by franque

It's up to you (and depends on your size, a little bit). With a Grom clone, you're basically going to the max of the intended performance envelope. If you were to get, say, a TBR7, you'll already have a more powerful motor, you'll be more geometrically stable, due to the bigger wheels/longer wheelbase, and you'll be able to venture rather afield than just 55mph zones.

Even with the swap, while the Grom clone might have the thrust to go faster, I'd imagine it'll start to feel unstable at speeds above ~60.

I was looking at some of the bigger bikes like the TBR7, Hawk, SSR XF250, Motomax/Brozz etc too. But the size of the Grom clone really appeals to me because I'm a smaller guy. Lol. I'll keep in mind what you said though. Thanks.

SirKng · 04-07-2020, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheelbender6

The Kymco K-Pipe, or a Chinese made equivalent may work better for a 190cc swap. The taller tires will feel more stable at highway speeds, as mentioned above.

That bike uses the same engine mount pattern as the Grom clones? If they do I'll put that on my list of bikes I'm considering. But I do like the Grom clone more though due to the Grom aftermarket...

wheelbender6 · 04-07-2020, 07:51 PM

Agreed. They make all kinds of goodies for the Grom. Not so much for the K-Pipe.

Rangerscott · 04-07-2020, 08:42 PM

Replace the wheel bearings with some Japanese or American ones.

RedCrowRides · 04-07-2020, 09:45 PM

The Z190 swap will get you plenty of speed to run 70mph , main reason being the 190 has a 5 speed gearbox and the final drive gear is higher than the 4 speed final cog in the stock motor -

That said, get your 12" rims balanced at a good motorcycle shop, that should give you enough stability ,they do NOT come balanced from the factory and the 70mph zone will induce a "death wobble" on some bikes that just isnt an issue at the usual sub 50-55 mph speeds these bikes run at stock., due to the unbalanced rim situation.

Lots of scooters will run 70 and they have 12" tires so it can be done ,the thing is balancing the rim / tires which is done on those from the factory , you can indeed get a steering stabilizer set up cheap off Ebay , i run one on my Vader 125 , mostly just for looks, but it does actually function.

SirKng · 04-07-2020, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedCrowRides

The Z190 swap will get you plenty of speed to run 70mph , main reason being the 190 has a 5 speed gearbox and the final drive gear is higher than the 4 speed final cog in the stock motor -

That said, get your 12" rims balanced at a good motorcycle shop, that should give you enough stability ,they do NOT come balanced from the factory and the 70mph zone will induce a "death wobble" on some bikes that just isnt an issue at the usual sub 50-55 mph speeds these bikes run at stock., due to the unbalanced rim situation.

Lots of scooters will run 70 and they have 12" tires so it can be done ,the thing is balancing the rim / tires which is done on those from the factory , you can indeed get a steering stabilizer set up cheap off Ebay , i run one on my Vader 125 , mostly just for looks, but it does actually function.

Good to know about balancing tires. I assumed that tires would be balanced from the factory but I'll look into that too if I get a Grom clone. Thanks for the heads up!

culcune · 04-08-2020, 12:29 AM

This bike from Boom uses the same engine, but has 17/17 wheels resulting in a higher top speed from stock. However, and I have visited Kronik Racing in person and have spoken to Pete, the owner, this bike might not have enough room for a 190cc. His store has equipped numerous customers' Vaders with 190cc, and to be honest, I would suggest to call him. I spoke to him last week, and he is actually doing lots of business during these times and did mention he got the last several Vaders and Lil Ducs from Boom probably until May. He is the Boom expert, as well as modifying them, and again, I would suggest to call him with your question.

https://www.kronikracing.com/-Boom-RETRO-125_p_423.html

These are the other minis he carries: https://www.kronikracing.com/Scooters.html

culcune · 04-08-2020, 12:50 AM

Here is another bike to consider. According to the site, these are now available. The price is probably around the same as a Vader with a 190cc engine (the ADV 190); Pitster's MSRPs are usually higher than what they end up selling their bikes for. You have to contact Pitster and speak with the owner, Gary Goodwin, for the best price. I would even think the 140cc version should get to the speed you seek. The problems I see with this bike is it is EPA certified as an 'offroad dirtbike' so your state would need to register dirtbikes with a minimum of street equipment. I am fairly certain I could register one of these in Arizona, but other states will vary. Not only that, I am not sure if this comes with all street equipment, such as turn signals and a horn. But, I would contact Pitster and either rule it out or put it on your short-list.

https://pitsterpro.com/index.php?rou...uct_id=1253258

SirKng · 04-08-2020, 07:35 AM

@culcune I saw the ADV 140R/190R while looking at engines for a swap. It's a very good looking bike but being certified for off road use only is gonna be the hard part for me since apparently here in Wisconsin it's hard to register off road bikes for on road use. (Which makes no sense at all since Wisconsin is the kind of state where that would make sense to allow off-road bikes on road but I digress...) I'm gonna do a little more digging on that though as I've heard it both ways, being able to and not being able to register off road bikes. So it's my maybe list for now.

PhildoScaggins · 04-08-2020, 08:38 AM

I have a grom clone with a zs190 swap I am looking to sell. I have not mounted the exhaust or the oil cooler. All the wiring is done, have done a grom swingarm and suspension swap. I work in logistics, could probably get it shipped to you. The motor is brand new and has not even been run. Dont know what your registration laws are there but I'm pretty sure I still have the MCO. I'm looking for $1200 before the price of shipping. Contact me if interested.

04-07-2020, 03:36 PM	#1
SirKng Join Date: Apr 2020 Location: Eau Claire, WI Posts: 117	ZS190 Swapped Grom Clone capabilities? So I'd like to know if a ZS190 swapped Grom clone can handle my commute. I live on a 55 MPH state highway with a slight hill at one point and it goes like that for 2-3 miles then it hits residential roads then back to a short stretch of 50 MPH highway. What do you all think? Yes? Or should I look for a bigger bike? I'm not really opposed to buying a brand new clone and swapping the engine before even riding it if this setup will work for my commute.
	0

04-07-2020, 05:36 PM	#2
kirbo7106 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Holiday, Florida Posts: 672	From a mechanical aspect, the 190 will get you there. From what I understand, the 190 will get you to 70 plus. The real question is, do YOU want to go that fast on 12 inch rims. Tell us about that stretch of road. Is it a 2 lane Or a four lane. On a 2 lane, I wouldn’t worry too much. On a four lane, cars are going to be traveling at 65-70 mph and they will pass you! If you check out YouTube, there are several people that ride on major roads with a Lifan KP 150 Mini Or a clone with a 190. If I were planning on riding a clone with a 190, I would have a few mods that I deem necessary! Brakes! I would get the big brake kit with stainless steel braided brake lines. Tires! Michelin has some nice tires. Lights! Definitely an LED headlight. As cool as the integrated turn signals are, I would go with these: They are on Amazon, look for BSK. They cost $45. MegaDan, and others, have them on their Hawk 250s and I have them on my HellCat. I’ve also seen a brake light that goes around your license plate. Not necessary, but still consider it. Keep us posted! __________________ Dan-O -2018 Tao Tao HellCat - DOA -2016 Hawk 250 - Kitty Hawk - eBay exhaust, Mikuni carb(120 main/30 Pilot), airbox mod with K&N filter, digital cluster, total LEDs, 17/45 sprockets, RK chain, Shinko 244 tires, trunk, aftermarket levers, burrito tube, skid plate, Sargent Cycle Seat... -2003 HD Sportster 100th Anniversary -1999 Buell X-1 Lightning - Race kit, Buell Seat
	2

04-07-2020, 05:42 PM	#3
wheelbender6 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Houston area Posts: 1,902	The Kymco K-Pipe, or a Chinese made equivalent may work better for a 190cc swap. The taller tires will feel more stable at highway speeds, as mentioned above. __________________ "Its not WHAT you ride; its THAT you ride"
	0

04-07-2020, 07:51 PM	#8
wheelbender6 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Houston area Posts: 1,902	Agreed. They make all kinds of goodies for the Grom. Not so much for the K-Pipe. __________________ "Its not WHAT you ride; its THAT you ride"
	0

04-07-2020, 09:45 PM	#10
RedCrowRides Join Date: Jun 2018 Location: Florida Posts: 759	The Z190 swap will get you plenty of speed to run 70mph , main reason being the 190 has a 5 speed gearbox and the final drive gear is higher than the 4 speed final cog in the stock motor - That said, get your 12" rims balanced at a good motorcycle shop, that should give you enough stability ,they do NOT come balanced from the factory and the 70mph zone will induce a "death wobble" on some bikes that just isnt an issue at the usual sub 50-55 mph speeds these bikes run at stock., due to the unbalanced rim situation. Lots of scooters will run 70 and they have 12" tires so it can be done ,the thing is balancing the rim / tires which is done on those from the factory , you can indeed get a steering stabilizer set up cheap off Ebay , i run one on my Vader 125 , mostly just for looks, but it does actually function. __________________ 2001 Mustang GT 2004 Sportster 2018 VADER 2020 Orion RXB250L
	0

04-07-2020, 06:17 PM	#4
franque Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Marseille, France -> Conakry, Guinea Posts: 1,481	It's up to you (and depends on your size, a little bit). With a Grom clone, you're basically going to the max of the intended performance envelope. If you were to get, say, a TBR7, you'll already have a more powerful motor, you'll be more geometrically stable, due to the bigger wheels/longer wheelbase, and you'll be able to venture rather afield than just 55mph zones. Even with the swap, while the Grom clone might have the thrust to go faster, I'd imagine it'll start to feel unstable at speeds above ~60.
	0

04-07-2020, 08:42 PM	#9
Rangerscott Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Texas Posts: 165	Replace the wheel bearings with some Japanese or American ones.
	1

04-08-2020, 12:29 AM	#12
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,056	This bike from Boom uses the same engine, but has 17/17 wheels resulting in a higher top speed from stock. However, and I have visited Kronik Racing in person and have spoken to Pete, the owner, this bike might not have enough room for a 190cc. His store has equipped numerous customers' Vaders with 190cc, and to be honest, I would suggest to call him. I spoke to him last week, and he is actually doing lots of business during these times and did mention he got the last several Vaders and Lil Ducs from Boom probably until May. He is the Boom expert, as well as modifying them, and again, I would suggest to call him with your question. https://www.kronikracing.com/-Boom-RETRO-125_p_423.html These are the other minis he carries: https://www.kronikracing.com/Scooters.html __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
	0

04-08-2020, 12:50 AM	#13
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,056	Here is another bike to consider. According to the site, these are now available. The price is probably around the same as a Vader with a 190cc engine (the ADV 190); Pitster's MSRPs are usually higher than what they end up selling their bikes for. You have to contact Pitster and speak with the owner, Gary Goodwin, for the best price. I would even think the 140cc version should get to the speed you seek. The problems I see with this bike is it is EPA certified as an 'offroad dirtbike' so your state would need to register dirtbikes with a minimum of street equipment. I am fairly certain I could register one of these in Arizona, but other states will vary. Not only that, I am not sure if this comes with all street equipment, such as turn signals and a horn. But, I would contact Pitster and either rule it out or put it on your short-list. https://pitsterpro.com/index.php?rou...uct_id=1253258 __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
	0

04-08-2020, 07:35 AM	#14
SirKng Join Date: Apr 2020 Location: Eau Claire, WI Posts: 117	@culcune I saw the ADV 140R/190R while looking at engines for a swap. It's a very good looking bike but being certified for off road use only is gonna be the hard part for me since apparently here in Wisconsin it's hard to register off road bikes for on road use. (Which makes no sense at all since Wisconsin is the kind of state where that would make sense to allow off-road bikes on road but I digress...) I'm gonna do a little more digging on that though as I've heard it both ways, being able to and not being able to register off road bikes. So it's my maybe list for now.
	1

04-08-2020, 08:38 AM	#15
PhildoScaggins Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Woods, Maine Posts: 247	I have a grom clone with a zs190 swap I am looking to sell. I have not mounted the exhaust or the oil cooler. All the wiring is done, have done a grom swingarm and suspension swap. I work in logistics, could probably get it shipped to you. The motor is brand new and has not even been run. Dont know what your registration laws are there but I'm pretty sure I still have the MCO. I'm looking for $1200 before the price of shipping. Contact me if interested.
	1