RPS first to second gear problems

DualSport · 02-14-2019, 02:17 PM

I've read a lot of threads on transmission issues but this wasn't covered..

My transmission goes 0-1, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5 fine, but 1-2 always goes in to neutral and I haven't figured out the exact trick to get it in second from neutral every time.. Sometimes it works fine and sometimes I have to slow down and play with the clutch and shifter some..

I got rid of the linkage shifter and put a XR 400 stock shifter on it, but it's done it with both.

Hawkward Files · 02-14-2019, 02:58 PM

Neutral is located between first and second it's 1,0,2,3,4,5. sometimes mine does it to depends on the RPM I shift at to low or if I don't shift the lever all the way up when going from 1st to 2nd it will hit neutral. watch RPMS and how you shift. When im dogging the piss out of mine I don't even clutch just shift wile rpms are dropping and right back to pouring the coals to it. when we putter around there is not enough RPMs to throw it on up into second.

DualSport · 02-14-2019, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawkward Files

Neutral is located between first and second it's 1,0,2,3,4,5. sometimes mine does it to depends on the RPM I shift at to low or if I don't shift the lever all the way up when going from 1st to 2nd it will hit neutral. watch RPMS and how you shift. When im dogging the piss out of mine I don't even clutch just shift wile rpms are dropping and right back to pouring the coals to it. when we putter around there is not enough RPMs to throw it on up into second.

Mine goes to neutral from first even with a hard shift with boots on. Then I have to fight it in to second no matter RPM. Every other gear shifts smooth.

Bruces · 02-14-2019, 06:33 PM

How many miles on it ?

wheel spinner · 02-14-2019, 06:54 PM

Just curious... Mine was hard to shift at one time and also very difficult trying to go into neutral.. I changed the oil several times when I figured out I was not using the right oil... so I bought some Rotella T-4 for wet clutches and put the correct amount in it and never had another problem with shifting... I can find Neutral easy.. the gears shift very smoothly .. it is so much better.. I just wanted to put that out there for another thought..

Megadan · 02-14-2019, 10:49 PM

There are a ton of things that can actually cause this type of issue. Barring more complicated mechanical things there are a few simpler ideas.

As silly as it sounds, even the shifter being in a position just off enough to not give full positive engagement on the shifter going into second can be a culprit. Thanks to the longer throw between 1-2, what seems to work well between every other gear can sometimes not work well in that particular shift throw. Just out of entertaining an idea have you tried to rotate the shifter down by 1 spline (or adjusting the linkage rod to move the shifter down) to see what effect it has?

The clutch adjustment, or more particularly clutch fade, can sometimes contribute to this kind of issue.

As wheel.spinner said, even the oil or condition of the oil can make a distinct difference. Rotella T4 is all I have run in my Hawk, and I actually ran it in my 1975 GL1000 Goldwing after running other types of oil, and of all the oils I tried the T4 actually provided the best shifting and clutch feel as well as the lowest gear noise.

Another curiosity of mine. How does it shift from Neutral to second? Any difference between a cold engine and a hot one? If you preload the shifter before using the clutch and shifting between first and second does it make a difference?

DualSport · 02-15-2019, 02:08 PM

113 on bike about 60 on engine

Always used Shell Rotella T4 and changed it this morning for the second time since I got this engine

If I start off in second by feathering clutch and giving it the revs to keep from bogging the engine it works fine. I just never go to first to avoid the issue currently.

Days back I put a old XR 400 shifter on it cause OEM had the linkage that was annoying, but it was happening before.

No matter rev if I do a hard upshift from first it goes to neutral every time and it's hell even with boots on to get it up to second and sometimes it won't even go I have to pull over and rock the bike and play with clutch and completely avoid first unless I'm just slow trail riding..

wheel spinner · 02-16-2019, 01:30 PM

Well.. at this point.. if this was my problem with my bike... I would start tearing the gear box down to see what the problem is... have you changed the oil lately to look for any metal shavings in the oil or filter/screen??? Not saying this is what you should do, but I know I would be doing this next.. sounds like you have tried everything else by process of illumination..

sounds like something may be out of position within the gears.. not lining up.. maybe your 2nd gear... that you have to force it in that gear.. Megadan.. what are your thoughts on what I just said???

Bruces · 02-16-2019, 02:26 PM

With 60 miles on it the bike isn’t broken in yet ,so just ride it and shift it and dump the oil a few extra times for the first 600 miles .

Megadan · 02-16-2019, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheel spinner

Megadan.. what are your thoughts on what I just said???

I more or less agree, if all other things have been tried and tested then the only logical next step is something internal with the gear box or shifting mechanism.

Ariel Red Hunter · 02-17-2019, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DualSport

I've read a lot of threads on transmission issues but this wasn't covered..

My transmission goes 0-1, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5 fine, but 1-2 always goes in to neutral and I haven't figured out the exact trick to get it in second from neutral every time.. Sometimes it works fine and sometimes I have to slow down and play with the clutch and shifter some..

I got rid of the linkage shifter and put a XR 400 stock shifter on it, but it's done it with both.

While it is possible it is a defective gear, it is much more likely to be in the shift stop/ratchet mechanism inside the outer case on the left side of the engine/transmission lump. The timing of the shifting drum to shift stop to the ratchet has to be right for it to work in harmony. You are not the first person to have this problem on this forum. It is NOT normal for the 1-n-2 shift to stick in n on its way to 2. ....ARH

02-14-2019, 02:17 PM	#1
DualSport Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 173	RPS first to second gear problems I've read a lot of threads on transmission issues but this wasn't covered.. My transmission goes 0-1, 2-3, 3-4, 4-5 fine, but 1-2 always goes in to neutral and I haven't figured out the exact trick to get it in second from neutral every time.. Sometimes it works fine and sometimes I have to slow down and play with the clutch and shifter some.. I got rid of the linkage shifter and put a XR 400 stock shifter on it, but it's done it with both.
	0

02-14-2019, 06:54 PM	#5
wheel spinner Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Suffolk Va. Posts: 146	Just curious... Mine was hard to shift at one time and also very difficult trying to go into neutral.. I changed the oil several times when I figured out I was not using the right oil... so I bought some Rotella T-4 for wet clutches and put the correct amount in it and never had another problem with shifting... I can find Neutral easy.. the gears shift very smoothly .. it is so much better.. I just wanted to put that out there for another thought.. __________________ 2006 Roketa DB-07-200 Dual Sport 2007 Monte Carlo SS 5.3 2010 Challenger Hemi 5.7 2004 Isuzu Rodeo 1998 Kia Sportage 4x4 2004 Toyota Tundra 2016 Ford Escape Guitars 1970 Gibson SG mint Condition 2005 Epiphone white Custom SG Les Paul L/New Fender Banjo New Condition BC Rich Bitch - Like New\ 3 Jay Turser SG Good Condition Amps Marshall vs100 Good Condition Acoustic 261 very good condition Boss GT-6 Pedal effects Like New
	2

02-14-2019, 10:49 PM	#6
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 8,043	There are a ton of things that can actually cause this type of issue. Barring more complicated mechanical things there are a few simpler ideas. As silly as it sounds, even the shifter being in a position just off enough to not give full positive engagement on the shifter going into second can be a culprit. Thanks to the longer throw between 1-2, what seems to work well between every other gear can sometimes not work well in that particular shift throw. Just out of entertaining an idea have you tried to rotate the shifter down by 1 spline (or adjusting the linkage rod to move the shifter down) to see what effect it has? The clutch adjustment, or more particularly clutch fade, can sometimes contribute to this kind of issue. As wheel.spinner said, even the oil or condition of the oil can make a distinct difference. Rotella T4 is all I have run in my Hawk, and I actually ran it in my 1975 GL1000 Goldwing after running other types of oil, and of all the oils I tried the T4 actually provided the best shifting and clutch feel as well as the lowest gear noise. Another curiosity of mine. How does it shift from Neutral to second? Any difference between a cold engine and a hot one? If you preload the shifter before using the clutch and shifting between first and second does it make a difference? __________________ Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 2024 Royal Enfield Shotgun 650 https://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=34124
	3

02-16-2019, 01:30 PM	#8
wheel spinner Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Suffolk Va. Posts: 146	Well.. at this point.. if this was my problem with my bike... I would start tearing the gear box down to see what the problem is... have you changed the oil lately to look for any metal shavings in the oil or filter/screen??? Not saying this is what you should do, but I know I would be doing this next.. sounds like you have tried everything else by process of illumination.. sounds like something may be out of position within the gears.. not lining up.. maybe your 2nd gear... that you have to force it in that gear.. Megadan.. what are your thoughts on what I just said??? __________________ 2006 Roketa DB-07-200 Dual Sport 2007 Monte Carlo SS 5.3 2010 Challenger Hemi 5.7 2004 Isuzu Rodeo 1998 Kia Sportage 4x4 2004 Toyota Tundra 2016 Ford Escape Guitars 1970 Gibson SG mint Condition 2005 Epiphone white Custom SG Les Paul L/New Fender Banjo New Condition BC Rich Bitch - Like New\ 3 Jay Turser SG Good Condition Amps Marshall vs100 Good Condition Acoustic 261 very good condition Boss GT-6 Pedal effects Like New
	0

02-14-2019, 02:58 PM	#2
Hawkward Files Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: New Mexico Boot Heel Posts: 25	Neutral is located between first and second it's 1,0,2,3,4,5. sometimes mine does it to depends on the RPM I shift at to low or if I don't shift the lever all the way up when going from 1st to 2nd it will hit neutral. watch RPMS and how you shift. When im dogging the piss out of mine I don't even clutch just shift wile rpms are dropping and right back to pouring the coals to it. when we putter around there is not enough RPMs to throw it on up into second.
	2

02-14-2019, 06:33 PM	#4
Bruces Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 1,588	How many miles on it ?
	0

02-15-2019, 02:08 PM	#7
DualSport Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 173	113 on bike about 60 on engine Always used Shell Rotella T4 and changed it this morning for the second time since I got this engine If I start off in second by feathering clutch and giving it the revs to keep from bogging the engine it works fine. I just never go to first to avoid the issue currently. Days back I put a old XR 400 shifter on it cause OEM had the linkage that was annoying, but it was happening before. No matter rev if I do a hard upshift from first it goes to neutral every time and it's hell even with boots on to get it up to second and sometimes it won't even go I have to pull over and rock the bike and play with clutch and completely avoid first unless I'm just slow trail riding..
	0

02-16-2019, 02:26 PM	#9
Bruces Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 1,588	With 60 miles on it the bike isn’t broken in yet ,so just ride it and shift it and dump the oil a few extra times for the first 600 miles .
	1